VELOGAMES- Tour de France 2018 Now Open!

[Geoffv]

The first big name withdrawal Michael Matthews

Tej Benoot also gone.

Keep the good work on Velogames. Miss is greatly.

[El Tel of Ealing]

PS El Tel, I entered that team early and changed it to sprint heavy lineup to get near the top of the standings. Wont be close to winning I feel. Do you still live in Ealing? I've been here for over 10 years.

The jinx continues.Benoot would have done for my Velogames team,although not as crippling as Valverde and Sagan last year.
George:I am in Ealing still and have been for longer than I care to remember.I am North of The Broadway station by the Ealing CC ground.

[jimmy ching]

Just spotted VELOGAMESFTW vingte, lying 19th in the French league of Letour Fantasy. We are not alone.

[blahblah]

Porte crashes out well before the Cobbles even start

Apologies for the but it was so predictable, and the only surprise is that G wasn't involved as well?

[jimmy ching]

That will please my son. He's supporting Thomas this year. He's still learning how to spell and pronounce Geraint.

[blahblah]

It's easy: ker ash

[jimmy ching]

D. GROENEWEGEN has withdrawn as Sagan is straggling today.

[jimmy ching]

Greipel has withdrawn as well. It's not a sprinters day.

[jimmy ching]

Well it is for the ones that are still going

[jimmy ching]

Another sprinter bites the dust. Gaviria

[liquidfootball2]

So it was sacred ground today - Col de la Madeleine, Croix de fer, Alpe D'Huez.

The greatest sporting arena in road cycling?

How long can it continue like today though?

With Nibali apparently knocked over by a motor bike and the usual 'look at me' rent a mob on every peak the situation is getting out of hand and the security can't cope

Haurem d'esperar a veure el video d'algun aficionat per veure què ha passat amb Nibali. La moto que seguia el grup se l'ha trobat després d'un núvol provocat per una bengala. #TDF2018

The situation has become so bad they may seriously have to consider some of these iconic routes up the Alps in future.. It just seems to be a magnet for drunken oafs these days who want to do nothing but abuse the riders and spoil the race.

Amid the chaos of racing, it needs to be said that Team Sky were afforded an especially unsavoury welcoming committee on the upper slopes of Alpe d'Huez this afternoon which nobody wants to see - except perhaps race sponsors ASO and the French press who have really gone out of their way to encourage such nonsense.


As stage winner GeraintThomas crossed the line there were audible boos from the crowds while the he also had to contend with similar on the winners' podium. Extremely disappointing.

Even more worrying was the sight of a cycling 'fan' appearing to push defending champion Froome while in pursuit of Bardet.

I would be surprised if we don't hear more of this, such a shame - threatening to ruin their own event

[forestfan]

They might have to start fencing them in/making certain bits off limits to the public. Which is a shame, as the closeness to the crowds is one of the things that makes it.

Are the mountain time limits too hard on the sprinters? It's a shame that none of the major players apart from Sagan will seemingly be in Paris (I know, he always gets green anyway just because he can pick up points on hilly stages...)

Anyway, interesting to see if Thomas is allowed to race Froome, he's likely to keep yellow until the Pyrenees I guess. Is it a Wiggins/Froome scenario in reverse? They will need to work together to shake off Dumoulin given his time trialling ability as well.

[blahblah]

Time limits: not usually, but Cav has struggled fro what I have seen this season and has had a lot of crashes. I haven't looked on steephill (http://www.steephill.tv/tour-de-france/) for any other info (he was well off in the sprints this year) - but he did finish even if outside the limit, rather than get off and is typical of why he is more adored than Froome ever will be, imho.

Froome vs Thomas: (without getting all King\Queen Bitch) today was interesting re Thomas marking Dumoulin as he reeled Froome back in and then kicked. If allowed he could repeat next week, and then it is down to the 31k TT. Oh and G is 5hite descending, and in the rain, so expect a crash if they coincide - his TT crash in the Crit: http://www.steephill.tv/players/youtube ... tw&yr=2018 was far from a surprise, but he did win the Overall.... I sense Dave B would prefer a G win

[liquidfootball2]

Writings been on the wall for Cav for a while, he only just made it the stage before - not his Tour.

He's only 33 so it's not like he's completely past it, I think he could still win stages, but if he can't ride consistently he'll never build the form he needs to stay in for long.


It's sad to see a partisan press and a vicious social media campaign now target Thomas too, the boos weren't universal but very noticeable and on the winner's podium too, how long before someone tries to push him off?


****************************

When you consider that in the context of the Froome case which has completely exonerated him from using a controlled (not a banned) substance incorrectly and well within expected limits, to target a fellow racer just because he's in the same team seems ridiculous.

I always thought this very enlightening....

Wada had access to information that the UCI does not, including ongoing and unpublished studies on the excretion of Salbutamol (which is - as confirmed by Wada Scientific Director - subject to considerable variations)

They are the leading experts on the variations to be expected under such conditions.

Only scientists who have this expertise should set limits.

The first thing to understand is that this was never a case, It was a process to determine whether they should bring a case. And 99% of the time that happens behind closed doors, in complete privacy.

In this case, it was public, which is really unfortunate and whoever leaked it — because somebody inside the UCI leaked it — it’s just nasty, vindictive behaviour to do that, It doesn’t actually allow the system to work in the way that it should in a case involving a restricted substance, as opposed to a banned substance.

A controlled pharmacokinetic study, was not insisted on by Wada in Froome’s case because it is completely impossible to replicate the circumstances.

I don’t know how you would replicate that in cycling I think it’s almost impossible.


The scientific experts on social media and their mates in the pub all know better of course

[forestfan]

The French don’t like it as they just see it as a transatlantic remake of the Armstrong and US Postal story, rightly or wrongly, they haven’t won their own race for over 30 years and don’t take kindly to having their noses rubbed in it by non-traditional cycling nations.

[blahblah]

Not so sure about Cav and "only 33", I hope he can come back again, but I fear this is the end.

Hopefully when\if unc returns from his global tour of narcotic capitals he will explain the following and I'll (almost certainly bow to his knowledge) but until then....

re Thomas heckling: the Wiggins injection for asthma with rocket fuel (D Millar, who I trust on this stuff) absolutely stinks, seriously an injection in the knee as pre-emptive strike on Asthma is MAD! People have been banned\suspended for less than what Froome had but didn't have the cash for the Lawyers. WADA are under funded and petrified of being sued for loss of earnings\reputation etc as they would be bust, unless the IOC (yep, that bastion of purirty) bailed them out so they will always cave in. Now into a football context if Liverpool were under such a shadow (beating Everton to the Prem title for however many years they have won it and toss in the CL for Froome having "won"\holding all 3 GT's) then all players will get the flak? Remember this is cleaner than clean Sky who didn't sign up to the Clean Cycling thang: they are generally hated and the drug stuff does actually take the pi55.

[liquidfootball2]

Yes Forest it gets ludicrous, the French press often point to other cyclists been banned for being over the Salbutamol limit with lower levels and then say surely they couldn't replicate it there too. - These cyclists have perhaps or very likely have been given rough justice and may have very strong cases for substantial damages.

The way i see it though is If a test is unreliable as the scientists now say is the case and has been used in the past to ban other cyclists, then the now known about unreliability renders their bans as incorrectly and wrongly given

To then say a test that has proved unreliable and been incorrectly used to ban cyclists in the past should nevertheless be used to ban cyclists now and in the future is just absolutely senseless, laughable even.

Two wrongs don't make a right

If the scientists maintain that a high degree of variability is to be expected under such extreme conditions and usage then they have far more expertise to determine such a fact than me or rent a mob on the alps and their mates on social media.

The test is no longer fit for purpose and regardless of past mistakes shouldn't be used.

[blahblah]

The French don’t like it as they just see it as a transatlantic remake of the Armstrong and US Postal story, rightly or wrongly, they haven’t won their own race for over 30 years and don’t take kindly to having their noses rubbed in it by non-traditional cycling nations.

Yep, less words, lol.

re PED's Virenque is still a GOD, but then so is Pantani.

The other problem Sky have is the Skyborg boring 5hite as they have killed "racing": afford loads of riders good enough to tempo fast enough to stop attacks, burn off contenders and get a TT rider (who has shrunk, but not lost power) to the top.....

The weirdest bit about Froome getting off was Sky releasing nutrition etc info about "that stage" in the Giro - it stunk of burying news to me ie there was more to the WADA backdown... but then I a am cynical thing

[liquidfootball2]

Not so sure about Cav and "only 33", I hope he can come back again, but I fear this is the end.

Hopefully when\if unc returns from his global tour of narcotic capitals he will explain the following and I'll (almost certainly bow to his knowledge) but until then....

re Thomas heckling: the Wiggins injection for asthma with rocket fuel (D Millar, who I trust on this stuff) absolutely stinks, seriously an injection in the knee as pre-emptive strike on Asthma is MAD! People have been banned\suspended for less than what Froome had but didn't have the cash for the Lawyers. WADA are under funded and petrified of being sued for loss of earnings\reputation etc as they would be bust, unless the IOC (yep, that bastion of purirty) bailed them out so they will always cave in. Now into a football context if Liverpool were under such a shadow (beating Everton to the Prem title for however many years they have won it and toss in the CL for Froome having "won"\holding all 3 GT's) then all players will get the flak? Remember this is cleaner than clean Sky who didn't sign up to the Clean Cycling thang: they are generally hated and the drug stuff does actually take the pi55.

I don't know the facts on Wiggins but am aware it looks mightily suspicious, the man himself seems to be on a one man campaign to undermine team sky and all who ride for it.

It does seem generally though as if some have taken rather extreme positions against team sky and are very willing to believe the very worst possible and damning stuff about all the team members especially Froome on as many occasions as possible, disregarding any evidence to the contrary and discrediting any sources that give any all helps.

I'm not naive enough to believe Wada isn't underfunded and can't be lent on or succumb to political or financial considerations, this happens all too often in all walks of life, but I wouldn't just dismiss a report that doesn't fit my agenda by thinking that must therefore must be the case.

It seems some people sort of extrapolate out from the Wiggins case to then cover all subsequent cases for sky cyclists and tar them with the same brush.

Wiggins possibly was guilty of real malpractice and i'm not disputing that at all, and it may well be the case that a cover up was initiated as seems extremely likely and of course Brailsford would be very culpable too.

I'm not though disregarding everything else until there's real evidence to the contrary. I will normally believe scientific studies and not naturally assume all sky cyclists since have been bent if there's nothing to back it up.

[liquidfootball2]

Not so sure about Cav and "only 33", I hope he can come back again, but I fear this is the end.

People have been banned\suspended for less than what Froome had but didn't have the cash for the Lawyers.

Cavendish is 33 according to his birth date on wiki.

Yes Sky are extremely well funded and do have top lawyers other teams don't, they are able to fight cases where they think they've been badly dealt with.

It doesn't mean they're crooked lawyers.

Now for my previous post again..

If a test is unreliable as the scientists now say is the case and has been used in the past to ban other cyclists, then the now known about unreliability renders their bans as incorrectly and wrongly given

To then say a test that has proved unreliable and been incorrectly used to ban cyclists in the past should nevertheless be used to ban cyclists now and in the future is just absolutely senseless, laughable even.

Two wrongs don't make a right

If the scientists maintain that a high degree of variability is to be expected then they have far more expertise to determine such a fact than you or me.

The test is no longer fit for purpose and regardless of past mistakes shouldn't be used.

[blahblah]

Not so sure about Cav and "only 33", I hope he can come back again, but I fear this is the end.

Hopefully when\if unc returns from his global tour of narcotic capitals he will explain the following and I'll (almost certainly bow to his knowledge) but until then....

re Thomas heckling: the Wiggins injection for asthma with rocket fuel (D Millar, who I trust on this stuff) absolutely stinks, seriously an injection in the knee as pre-emptive strike on Asthma is MAD! People have been banned\suspended for less than what Froome had but didn't have the cash for the Lawyers. WADA are under funded and petrified of being sued for loss of earnings\reputation etc as they would be bust, unless the IOC (yep, that bastion of purirty) bailed them out so they will always cave in. Now into a football context if Liverpool were under such a shadow (beating Everton to the Prem title for however many years they have won it and toss in the CL for Froome having "won"\holding all 3 GT's) then all players will get the flak? Remember this is cleaner than clean Sky who didn't sign up to the Clean Cycling thang: they are generally hated and the drug stuff does actually take the pi55.

I don't know the facts on Wiggins but am aware it looks mightily suspicious, the man himself seems to be on a one man campaign to undermine team sky and all who ride for it.

It does seem generally though as if some have taken rather extreme positions against team sky and are very willing to believe the very worst possible and damning stuff about all the team members especially Froome on as many occasions as possible, disregarding any evidence to the contrary and discrediting any sources that give any all helps.

I'm not naive enough to believe Wada isn't underfunded and can't be lent on or succumb to political or financial considerations, this happens all too often in all walks of life, but I wouldn't just dismiss a report that doesn't fit my agenda by thinking that must therefore must be the case.

It seems some people sort of extrapolate out from the Wiggins case to then cover all subsequent cases for sky cyclists and tar them with the same brush.

Wiggins possibly was guilty of real malpractice and i'm not disputing that at all, and it may well be the case that a cover up was initiated as seems extremely likely and of course Brailsford would be very culpable too.

I'm not though disregarding everything else until there's real evidence to the contrary. I will normally believe scientific studies and not naturally assume all sky cyclists since have been bent if there's nothing to back it up.

Ergh to the Sky\Wiggins line?

I think you have missed something as Sky have gone to the edge ie spirit\letter. In theory a DR\GP could have prescribed an injection as a pre-emptive strike on Asthma, but it is usually a life\death thing, I believe its side effects are HUGE for a cyclist (and far more than Adam Baxter gained from a "wrong" vic up his nose) and contrasts to the Yates suspension for an inhaler which his team said was an Admin error for an asthma sufferer, but apparently not a rocket fuel needle..

Cycling has Brad as either a cheat or Sky as the cheat and him as an innocent victim, but he has dashed that?

Cycling is suspicious of Froome from his Passport of convenience to where did he come from and how. The sky story\explanation is "get a TT bod who can climb a bit and shrink them with no\little power loss so they can climb and still TT" This could be where Dumoulin has come form and TT'ing climbs, and as above g can sit behind and then kick, so if Tom catches Froome, G wins... subject to the TT and Tom is rather good at them.

I will normally believe scientific studies and not naturally assume all sky cyclists since have been bent if there's nothing to back it up. You are the wrong side of the coin here, as they have been saying they are since Day 1 - now very few believe them. they had Zero tolerance and recruited "known" Druggies - admittedly when exposed they sacked them. BUT THEY NEVER SIGNED UP TO THE CLEAN CYCLING GROUP\REGS. If they had, then Froome would have not ridden from that stage in Spain, or when test came though.

[blahblah]

Basically it is very easy to think Sky stink: seriously the line that Froome was dehydrated to be only 1.2 over the limit not 2 times, so he was\is OK. Toss i the Brad injection and ..... while they stand aside from Teams who "bench" suspected riders...

goin go now

But the cycling Ped thing is the team organised stuff as opposed to individual and Sky should hang them out to dry, but they can;t as they are so controlled and top down....

[liquidfootball2]

blah, I find it extremely difficult to decipher some of your posts, they seem to almost be written in a code with oblique references to other things.

I barely commented on Wiggins because I wasn't in any position to do so other than say it looks mightily suspicious, that hasn't changed. I therefore stated I wouldn't dispute anything regarding this.

Sky are no angels and have always tested the limits but I know some views are so firmly entrenched and implacable that no amount of evidence or truths will do when the sources can be attacked and discredited or an odd conspiracy theory or two thrown in.

If you're only inclined to paint Sky as black as possible and believe the worst possible motives then I won't change it and i won't try.

(Sky aren't the only well financed team, even Nibali's team are a plaything of the Bahrain royal family and their enormous rap sheet of human rights abuses. They're an okay owner apparently for some although admittedly I digress)

[forestfan]

Not so sure about Cav and "only 33", I hope he can come back again, but I fear this is the end.

People have been banned\suspended for less than what Froome had but didn't have the cash for the Lawyers.

Cavendish is 33 according to his birth date on wiki.

I don't think he was querying his actual age... but 33 is pretty old for a front-line sprinter, even if it would be less so for a GC contender (Froome is the same age). He's got a lot of miles in those legs as well, and not sure he will ever rediscover that explosive finish to the extent that he can worry younger rivals.

The occasional sprinter has stayed competitive into mid-late 30s I think (Petacchi?) but more have probably reinvented themselves in a different role. Obviously he's not going to become a climber and can't see him wanting to be a lead out man for someone else. One last fling on the track for Tokyo perhaps?

[liquidfootball2]

Not so sure about Cav and "only 33", I hope he can come back again, but I fear this is the end.

People have been banned\suspended for less than what Froome had but didn't have the cash for the Lawyers.

Cavendish is 33 according to his birth date on wiki.

I don't think he was querying his actual age... but 33 is pretty old for a front-line sprinter, even if it would be less so for a GC contender (Froome is the same age). He's got a lot of miles in those legs as well, and not sure he will ever rediscover that explosive finish to the extent that he can worry younger rivals.

The occasional sprinter has stayed competitive into mid-late 30s I think (Petacchi?) but more have probably reinvented themselves in a different role. Obviously he's not going to become a climber and can't see him wanting to be a lead out man for someone else. One last fling on the track for Tokyo perhaps?

Yes the quotes did indicate that, but i've largely giving up trying to interpret posts on football, cricket or other sports that aren't reasonably clearly expressed and easily read.

[blahblah]

Not so sure about Cav and "only 33", I hope he can come back again, but I fear this is the end.

People have been banned\suspended for less than what Froome had but didn't have the cash for the Lawyers.

Cavendish is 33 according to his birth date on wiki.

I don't think he was querying his actual age... but 33 is pretty old for a front-line sprinter, even if it would be less so for a GC contender (Froome is the same age). He's got a lot of miles in those legs as well, and not sure he will ever rediscover that explosive finish to the extent that he can worry younger rivals.

The occasional sprinter has stayed competitive into mid-late 30s I think (Petacchi?) but more have probably reinvented themselves in a different role. Obviously he's not going to become a climber and can't see him wanting to be a lead out man for someone else. One last fling on the track for Tokyo perhaps?

Pretty much: 2016 was amazing and I have him with R Millar\P York as the best British cyclists of my lifetime. (well and Ms P's ass, lol)

Apologies for the drinkled stuff: I'll go through it tomorrow and explain.

Basically Sky are as unpopular as Revie's Leeds would have been if they had won what they should have, ie everything numerous times

[Moist von Lipwig]

Bit late to the party but..

I cannot believe that the ASO have spiked Velogames - disgusting. I could not bring myself to join their league after that. My entire family (all 3 of us) are livid.

Just got through the entirety of yesterdays stage, marvellous stuff (apart from some fans...) - I'm currently being press ganged into riding that next year, not in one day thankfully.

[bluelionman]

I feel like I've missed a great tour but I boycotted it this year in protest at the Velogames TdF game having to be suspended!
However listen to talksport on my DAB at work and keep hearing the headlines and surprised Geraint Thomas sounds as if he will win this years edition. Gutted to think team I entered before game got suspended has Froome, Dumoulin and might have had Thomas to - can't recall now but possibly.

[blahblah]

I feel like I've missed a great tour but I boycotted it this year in protest at the Velogames TdF game having to be suspended!
However listen to talksport on my DAB at work and keep hearing the headlines and surprised Geraint Thomas sounds as if he will win this years edition. Gutted to think team I entered before game got suspended has Froome, Dumoulin and might have had Thomas to - can't recall now but possibly.

Not sure it has been; and yesterday's FI kinda grid was a dry squid, imho; and if it had worked then it would have been bad ie dumping G, everyone's fave GC Brit out of the Tour among others in first bend carnage. A good idea that didn't work, imho. 50-100k's before would have it rock at lest as much?

Imagine a non TT stage just up d'Huez, where there could be a race to the first bend.... and as 1st Stage

[jimmy ching]

I feel like I've missed a great tour but I boycotted it this year in protest at the Velogames TdF game having to be suspended!
However listen to talksport on my DAB at work and keep hearing the headlines and surprised Geraint Thomas sounds as if he will win this years edition. Gutted to think team I entered before game got suspended has Froome, Dumoulin and might have had Thomas to - can't recall now but possibly.

I had Froome and Thomas shoed in with the help of Pasqualon as my 4 credit enabler. I had chosen Gaviria above Sagan. That would have cost me.

In my early Velogames days, I used Sagan as my 4 credit enabler. Those were the days.....