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FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

FISO Defenders Against Strikers (FISODAS) Games run by Jester (previously Shrews, Barry & Jester)
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Smurphy Paw
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Smurphy Paw »

Ooh, always an exciting day when I see FISODAS high up on the Latest Topics page

I’d be back in a flash if a re-start was on the cards

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Oxford NZ
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Oxford NZ »

I have a copy of the sheet and will put some time into trying to streamline and make it more automated, but first I need more of an idea what FISODAS is and what is needed from a sheet :?
I have never played the game and have only found a thread with the rules for guidance so far. viewtopic.php?p=2801&hilit=fisodas#p2801
Thanks in advance, any help is appreciated :)

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by wahine »

Ok Briefly, it's been a long time... The scoring pits defence against attack with five attack players adding up to (so many) points
The administration sets the odds for the defence of each team based on fixtures EACH GW and the odds for the likely goal scorers.

The participants matchups have to be formulated, and the entries are submitted in secret format (via email or PM) to the administrator who has the huge job of checking the entries are all correct. and posting the teamsheets.
there are chips and rules around their use...

format for each entry
Chelsea 10 :lol:

Ronaldo 8
Foden 6
Rodrigo 3
Hwang 2
Gray 1

I will try and find a better link :mrgreen: for you, thanks so much ONZ

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by wahine »

viewtopic.php?t=127056

:shock: then there is the bonus tables to be updated
and all the results posted...

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Oxford NZ »

wahine wrote: 25 Oct 2021, 05:08 Ok Briefly, it's been a long time... The scoring pits defence against attack with five attack players adding up to (so many) points
The administration sets the odds for the defence of each team based on fixtures EACH GW and the odds for the likely goal scorers.

The participants matchups have to be formulated, and the entries are submitted in secret format (via email or PM) to the administrator who has the huge job of checking the entries are all correct. and posting the teamsheets.
there are chips and rules around their use...

format for each entry
Chelsea 10 :lol:

Ronaldo 8
Foden 6
Rodrigo 3
Hwang 2
Gray 1

I will try and find a better link :mrgreen: for you, thanks so much ONZ
I guess a google sheet that will allow players to input their picks, then links to a sheet that compiles the results ( data scrape to get the data for the picks).
Then all that is needed from an admin is to set the pricing, fixtures and report.

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forestfan
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by forestfan »

The entries are done by a “widget” (entry form) on the site, as per FISO Goals. The administrator can then access the page of entry data and copy and paste it into Excel.

(In the old days, Jester and others dealt with inputting 40 or 50 manual PM/email entries, I really don’t know how they did it…)

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by morganb »

Only coming from a player perspective:

At the start of the season, leagues and weekly fixtures were decided

Weekly, weighted prices were set for the team defences playing on Saturday and Sunday only - was there some magic formula for this, was it simply based on the league position of the two teams in each match or did you look at previous week's results/form, etc.

Weighted prices were set for 20-30 'strikers' - again was this simply from who their opposition was or based on form too. How were strikers/midfielders chosen from week to week (there was often a random low price player or too). Players declared injured after the list was published on a Tuesday remained selectable.

Then the above had to allow you to pick your 1x defence plus 5 x players to fit within a budget. Only 1 player per team was allowed too.

There were 3 jokers available
Defensive shield, star striker and budget boost

Players entered their picks into the Widget

There was a Friday midnight deadline

There were penalties for late submission, over budget, two players from same team (none of which were restricted on entry)

No shows were covered by Barry's randoms

Match picks were published on Saturday morning

Results and league tables were published on Sunday. Half time scores came out on Saturday evening.

Scoring was -1 for every goal your defence conceded

Strikers scored 1 per goal scored

There were play offs, relegation and promotions at the end of the season

Think this cover most elements

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morganb
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by morganb »

So, for the automation side - it may be easy to scrape the results data from somewhere then look up goals conceded by a team and goals scored by a player (unique names permitting).

Setting up the weekly prices could be trickier depending on what logic was used and how manual a process it is. Does it require historical data?

Assume we still use the widget as it kept your opponents picks hidden

Extracting entries to get out the weekly head to head picks may be straightforward.

Calculating the fixtures and weekly league tables should be ok.

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by forestfan »

Player pricing was something that every organiser did differently. I wrote a semi-automated spreadsheet where player values were dependent on a base price (which I think I started off with TFF prices but could change manually based on form) plus strength of opponent - and then just tweaking the order if it didn’t look right. I chose usually 2 or 3 players per PL team in action that week to include, perhaps more from the bigger teams. But this is an area that is entirely up to the person running it!

Entering the goals actually scored and conceded by players/teams was a manual process, but I then automated the production of match results/tables from that.

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Richt »

The 3rd striker position was your captain and scored double.

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Jester »

It was way more automated when I stopped running it than when I started!
Everything was done in the widget (go Rob!) so I just copy/pasted from there into the s/sheet and ran the macro.
The only fully manual operations were pricing players (time consuming but necessary in my view as it allowed for some 'tweaking to add to the entertainment' - really cheap goodish player or way too high to afford with a decent defence options, and writing the short summaries of what happened each week. Oh, non-shows of course - how could I forget no-shows...?!!

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by forestfan »

Jester wrote: 27 Oct 2021, 15:34 It was way more automated when I stopped running it than when I started!
Everything was done in the widget (go Rob!) so I just copy/pasted from there into the s/sheet and ran the macro.
The only fully manual operations were pricing players (time consuming but necessary in my view as it allowed for some 'tweaking to add to the entertainment' - really cheap goodish player or way too high to afford with a decent defence options, and writing the short summaries of what happened each week. Oh, non-shows of course - how could I forget no-shows...?!!
Yeah, I already mentioned no-shows being a hassle! Of course we could have just awarded a default but at some stage it was decided that it was best if the opponent of a no-show still got a game. Same goes for people who overspend/pick teams that don’t meet the rules etc.

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by morganb »

So, how far did we get with this?

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Malrom
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Malrom »

no real progress, but some discussions in the background!

Please be patient, everybody!

Happy New Year, still 361 days left!

I had absolutely no time in December....

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morganb
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by morganb »

Do you think we can get this up and running for the final game week of the season? :lol:

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Jester »

No shows have to play the following week....

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by forestfan »

Forest, Huddersfield, Liverpool and Real Madrid players only ;)

Unfortunately seems we hit the point where the spreadsheets were just too much for a newcomer to get to grips with. Would have been chaos with the Covid-hit parts of the season anyway.

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Malrom »

I haven't really given up yet!
But suddenly another important thing shows up and I have to concentrate on that....
Now it's moving with my family at the end of June.

btw, who's in charge of the Excel upload? How can I get acces to: https://www.fiso.co.uk/games/fisodas/
How can I get access rights to the Admin section?

There is a critical error right now

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Richt »

Wow, I have only just noticed that this could be making a comeback.

I would be all over this like a tramp on chips if it does. One of the best games ever on FISO.

Be sure to PM everyone!

In the words of Borat "I am very excite".

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forestfan
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by forestfan »

Richt wrote: 20 May 2022, 11:01 Wow, I have only just noticed that this could be making a comeback.

I would be all over this like a tramp on chips if it does. One of the best games ever on FISO.

Be sure to PM everyone!

In the words of Borat "I am very excite".
To be fair it’s been under discussion on and off for a couple of years but the spreadsheet has scared everyone off, bar myself and Jester, neither of whom are keen on the idea of committing the time to it again.

Would be great for it to come back in some form but don’t know how feasible it’s likely to be.

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Jester »

I keep thinking 'oh go on then, but just the one division to keep it as simple as possible', but it doesn't work that way - you still need forty strikers and twenty defences pricing up. Then there are no shows to handle....
Hope I'm not scaring off Malrom now - it's a piece of cake really!! ;-)

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by forestfan »

Yeah, no-shows were the biggest hassle - the easy way out would have just been to award the opponent a 5-0 win but that would have distorted the competition so we had to mess around with giving them random opponents etc.!

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by morganb »

Could "Barry's Randoms" be some kind of average league score rather than an actual team, or have any no-shows replaced by a team from another league but in the same league position?

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Smurphy Paw »

We could just ask Barry to pop in each week and pick some randoms :mrgreen:

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by forestfan »

It wasn’t so much the randoms themselves, which I automated a lot - just having to adjust the scores, tables, bonuses etc. to reflect a no-show… all added up. That and applying the penalties for invalid teams, again could have just defaulted games but we always wanted to retain a contest while applying a fair disadvantage. It’s the head-to-head format that makes it awkward, in most weekly entry type games you’d just score zero if you didn’t pick and it wouldn’t impact anyone else. The lowest division often contained a few new players who didn’t stick with it and so there were a lot of games impacted, it was only fair to those who did enter each week to get a game rather than a walkover.

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Malrom »

Malrom wrote: 18 May 2022, 21:36 I haven't really given up yet!
But suddenly another important thing shows up and I have to concentrate on that....
Now it's moving with my family at the end of June.

btw, who's in charge of the Excel upload? How can I get acces to: https://www.fiso.co.uk/games/fisodas/
How can I get access rights to the Admin section?

There is a critical error right now
Can you please have a look at this problem? Whoever feels like responsible 8-) 8-)

Thank you all!

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morganb
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by morganb »

"The time has come," the Walrus said,
"To talk of many things:
Of shoes—and ships—and sealing-wax—
Of FISODAS—and kings

Any updates?

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Malrom
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Malrom »

morganb wrote: 24 Jul 2022, 11:41 "The time has come," the Walrus said,
"To talk of many things:
Of shoes—and ships—and sealing-wax—
Of FISODAS—and kings

Any updates?
I'm sorry, but not really!

I haven't even started testing yet, too many things are still missing.
Please be patient!

maybe after the WC?

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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by wahine »

Would any FISODAS players be interested in a VERY simple alternative.

A Gameweek by gameweek changing template of clean sheet odds and goal scorer odds.

Where there are no matchups but every weekly entry will score cumulative gameweek points until the end of the season.
So the more times FISO players enter, the higher chances of winning but no penalty if you don't enter?

It could be on the main day only?
And could be entered by PM which could be copied and pasted after the deadline and kept on a dedicated thread.
The only admin would be adding to 20 :D and setting the weekly odds.

There would be no chips so Murf would be able to play. Just a captain, maybe???

Just worked up a rough template for an idea…

GW1
Liverpool 10
Spurs 10
Chelsea 10
Wolves 7
Newcastle7
Aston Villa7
Southampton 7
Everton 5
Fulham 5
Bournemouth 5
Leeds 5
Nottingham Forest 5


You have 20 points to spend on both defence and attack and must pick one defence and five attack
The defence loses 2 points for every goal scored against and the attack scores 1 point for each goal.

Salah 8
Nunez 7
Diaz 5
Kane 8
Son 8
Neto 3 Wilson 3…
Saint-Max 2 Mitro 2….

2 being the minimum with lots of choices, so you can not pick too many premiums in either division??.
Example entry

Liverpool 10
2
2
2
2
2
20 total

Those 5 players would have to score more than 10 goals to score points.(or - points)

Fulham 5
5 Diaz
3 Neto
3 Wilson
2
2
20 Total
Those five attack would need to score 5+ goals to earn points but 7+ goals if defence conceded 1 goal.


Something like that? I would have to give it a bit more thought to make it difficult???

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Jester
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Re: FISODAS Season 32 - Announcement

Post by Jester »

I would be interested wahine, but at a glance it doesn't look that simple to me - especially for the admin (you?)

Thanks for trying to make it happen - hope a few take you up on it! :-)

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