Europe Dream Team - Strategy

[sleuth]

Dot,

I don't begrudge you but I have a slightly different take on what has gone on here.

The reporter - Steven Howard - has obviously filed copy and submitted ratings shortly after the final whistle. He picked Iniesta as star man and that was posted on Twitter and Facebook DT accounts around 2245 last night. The sun report of the final STILL has Iniesta as SM so not sure how you can say the website clearly states Suarez.
because in the middle of Steven Howard's account of the game is says in big letters on the website, more from Berlin . See how the rated. Barcelona ratings & Juventus ratings



Clearly the newspaper guys concoct the King Luis headline and alter SM to Suarez. It is a complete joke.




I believe I finish 6th now hence the grand figure I quote.
Bran in current 6th , 1 pt behind you has both Iniesta and Suarez so his points would remain the same either-way and therefore you would be 5th

Again- I respect your view and if you get the 2k then fair play to you but I'll be fighting hard for what I should be getting.

I also believe a match report should reflect the ratings given and in Steven Howard's match report its all about Suarez so you would expect the MOTM to be Suarez.
If it wasn't going to be Suarez then according to Howard's report it should of gone to Buffoon for keeping be score down.

Most marks do not reflect the report I find and that's why it's hard to accept that the ratings given are indeed by the respective reporter.

But what I would add is that the marks are identical but the starman is different and for all intents and purposes the match report strongly reflects that Suarez was the MOTM in Howard's eyes at least.

[bennyc]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... ona-3.html

Iniesta is still listed as SM. Where does Howard say Suarez is SM?

[sleuth]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... ona-3.html

Iniesta is still listed as SM. Where does Howard say Suarez is SM?

This is the beginning of the report by Howard.


well it just had to be him, didn’t it?

No, not Lionel Messi, as most of us expected, but old Mr Angry.

Or Mr Hungry.

The bloke who always looked like he could eat an apple through a tennis racket but seemed to prefer shoulders and arms.

Yes, our old mate Luis Suarez.

Ten months ago, he was Public Enemy No1 — last night he was the toast of Berlin, Barcelona and Uruguay.

They were probably raising a few glasses to him on Merseyside, too.

With the Champions League final locked tantalisingly at 1-1 here at the Olympic Stadium it was Suarez’s deadly anticipation and finishing that won Barca their fifth trophy.

Then in the middle of this report it has this.
MORE FROM BERLIN

SUAREZ ON HIS ‘DREAM’ COME TRUE

ANTONY KASTRINAKIS’ BIG-MATCH VERDICT

POGBA PAIN AT REF ‘MISTAKES’

JUVENTUS: HOW THEY RATED

BARCELONA: HOW THEY RATED

So you go to the links and you have what I have pasted earlier with STARMAN being Suarez.


ANDREA INIESTA

First player to provide assists in three Champions League finals. Boy are Barca going to miss him once he has to go. 8

LIONEL MESSI

For once he did not destroy the opposition with his runs but still had a major influence with a hand in everything. 8

LUIS SUAREZ

STAR MAN. Never gave up and was rewarded with the goal that justified the £75m Liverpool received for him last summer. Booked. 8

-=================

These identical ratings are also what are in today's edition of today's Sun in two full page spreads with Suarez being Starman and the report imo reflecting as much.

[Ashers]

Here they are in one place:

Main Article:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... ona-3.html (Star Man - Iniesta)

Link in Main Article:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... rated.html (Star Man - Suarez)

[sleuth]

Here they are in one place:

Main Article:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... ona-3.html (Star Man - Iniesta)

Link in Main Article:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... rated.html (Star Man - Suarez)

Not forgetting what's been published in today's paper is with Starman being Suarez so it's in favour twice of which the Sun agreed.

[Backlash]

I guess it's 1 way to increase their online subscriptions.

[CBN]

One of these days I could see the Gambling Commission revoking DT's licence. Far too much of this 'goes on' to be justified as clerical error.

[bennyc]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... ona-3.html

Iniesta is still listed as SM. Where does Howard say Suarez is SM?

This is the beginning of the report by Howard.


well it just had to be him, didn’t it?

No, not Lionel Messi, as most of us expected, but old Mr Angry.

Or Mr Hungry.

The bloke who always looked like he could eat an apple through a tennis racket but seemed to prefer shoulders and arms.

Yes, our old mate Luis Suarez.

Ten months ago, he was Public Enemy No1 — last night he was the toast of Berlin, Barcelona and Uruguay.

They were probably raising a few glasses to him on Merseyside, too.

With the Champions League final locked tantalisingly at 1-1 here at the Olympic Stadium it was Suarez’s deadly anticipation and finishing that won Barca their fifth trophy.

Then in the middle of this report it has this.
MORE FROM BERLIN

SUAREZ ON HIS ‘DREAM’ COME TRUE

ANTONY KASTRINAKIS’ BIG-MATCH VERDICT

POGBA PAIN AT REF ‘MISTAKES’

JUVENTUS: HOW THEY RATED

BARCELONA: HOW THEY RATED

So you go to the links and you have what I have pasted earlier with STARMAN being Suarez.


ANDREA INIESTA

First player to provide assists in three Champions League finals. Boy are Barca going to miss him once he has to go. 8

LIONEL MESSI

For once he did not destroy the opposition with his runs but still had a major influence with a hand in everything. 8

LUIS SUAREZ

STAR MAN. Never gave up and was rewarded with the goal that justified the £75m Liverpool received for him last summer. Booked. 8

-=================

These identical ratings are also what are in today's edition of today's Sun in two full page spreads with Suarez being Starman and the report imo reflecting as much.

I hadn't seen this. I (reasonably) presumed that the ratings at the bottom of the article were accurate as they reflected DT social media postings on Facebook and Twitter within an hour of the game stating Iniesta was MOM.

Well done, Dot. I expect the guy who thinks he's won 2k is going to apoplectic with rage when be discovers he's won eff all.

[sleuth]

The first time I saw the ratings for the game were actually on the Dreamteam webpage which seemed very quick to update considering there were monetary prizes to be settled that was at 10.24.as shown.

I kept checking the Sun sports news page to see confirmation of the ratings and don't believe there were first put up till nearer 11 pm. There were match reports immediately but no ratings as early as the webpage was updated I'm sure. I wanted to see their player appraisal because in all honesty Iniesta was never MOTM for me and their report neither pointed to that being so.
Not long after upon checking the Sun page again was where I saw the same ratings but with Suarez being awarded the Starman.
The only tweet I've seen by the Sun was this.

19h
Dream Team ✔ @dreamteamfc
#UCLfinal STAR MAN is Andres Iniesta.

Agree?
ExpandReplyRetweetFavorite

19 hours ago

Were they asking or stating? Dunno.

Backlash actually posted in this thread this

Postby Backlash » 06 Jun 2015, 22:19

Looks like Iniesta starman

Within 5 minutes the tables were updated but I never saw anything for a while on the Suns page, but slowly there were adding more paragraphs to their match reports and then the ratings went up with Iniesta Starman .

I suspect whoever has the facility to update the final table did so in haste and went home before 11 and then the shit hits the fan when the Sun announces 'See How They Rated' with individual Comments for each player. They are the same ratings but with a resume/summary on each player but with Suarez being the Starman and that is what went to press last night and is displayed in today's paper and still online.

I don't really know for sure what will happen tomorrow even though the stance taken by the help desk is that Suarez will be the final Starman as I've been informed and you say you have too.

But I honestly believe anything could happen.

[bennyc]

There was also this on FB.

[sleuth]

There was also this on FB.

Fair enough but as I say that says 22.43 the time, like I was saying I'm sure the actual ratings were not on the Sun page till around this time and before 11.

the ratings could be seen first by looking at the dreamteam page and leaderboard by going on the Statzone which was updated as stated in the righthand corner at 22.24

Points updated 22:24:33 06/06/2015

I have found following the European game that this is the norm to see the ratings first before they hit the Suns page.

The 'How they rated' with resume didn't come on their page till after 11 as I was going to bed and looked in again to discover the anomaly.

[Edmondson]

I would hope they pay out on both, sorry to hear the situation for both bennyc and Dot. It's not that often in this game that you have a chance of four figure sums, and shouldn't be tainted by this sort of rubbish.

One point I'd like to make, as bennyc has raised it, Dot has mentioned it, and I see others mention a fair bit in the past. The Gambling Commission. It simply isn't going to help you in these instances. All they are there for is to make sure the sun have a complaints procedure and will direct you down that route.

From their website:

"We may investigate issues which you report to us. We will not investigate the facts of the complaint, but we will check that there is a complaints procedure in place and challenge the licence holder to follow that procedure fully. This process may take some time, but you can expect an acknowledgement of your complaint about the licence holder, from us within three working days."

We had all this with Tam a few years back, genuinely cheating the game, caught red handed using players not even on the list, clear evidence produced for SDT, who still didn't act. Gambling Commission not interested. Eventually with more evidence SDT did take action.

That's your only hope, lodge your complaint in the best way you can, if they don't sort out first up. Then hope for the best. This idea that some external body will come along and sort it out for you, is I'm afraid complete nonsense.

[sleuth]

I would hope they pay out on both, sorry to hear the situation for both bennyc and Dot. It's not that often in this game that you have a chance of four figure sums, and shouldn't be tainted by this sort of rubbish.

One point I'd like to make, as bennyc has raised it, Dot has mentioned it, and I see others mention a fair bit in the past. The Gambling Commission. It simply isn't going to help you in these instances. All they are there for is to make sure the sun have a complaints procedure and will direct you down that route.

From their website:

"We may investigate issues which you report to us. We will not investigate the facts of the complaint, but we will check that there is a complaints procedure in place and challenge the licence holder to follow that procedure fully. This process may take some time, but you can expect an acknowledgement of your complaint about the licence holder, from us within three working days."

We had all this with Tam a few years back, genuinely cheating the game, caught red handed using players not even on the list, clear evidence produced for SDT, who still didn't act. Gambling Commission not interested. Eventually with more evidence SDT did take action.

That's your only hope, lodge your complaint in the best way you can, if they don't sort out first up. Then hope for the best. This idea that some external body will come along and sort it out for you, is I'm afraid complete nonsense.

Yeah I read that as I was looking to see where I stood regarding a complaint.

So I fired off an email to Dave Watkins and also called the Helpdesk and was surprised when there was somebody working there today. Dunno if Benny spoke to the same person, but I'm looking forward to developments tomorrow after their assurances that Suarez will indeed by the starman on a revised updated table.... but seeing is believing...

[bennyc]

I spoke to a bloke who gave his name but I don't recall it. He didn't know what I was on about initially and basically said 'Iniesta is star man on the system, mate....' I asked him to check the newspaper and he popped me hold and then said 'oh yeah...that's a problem cos its Suarez in the paper and they'll go on that.'

When I asked how the reporter had misspelt Suarez as Iniesta and the online report coupled with social media had Iniesta as star man he said 'it depends on what the paper says' to which I replied 'does the reporter do the ratings or not?' to which he repeated the previous response.

I don't know how they continuously cock up on straight forward things. Incompetence? Probably. Something more sinister? Unlikely - but repeat instances of star men changing doesn't help them on the integrity front.

[Edmondson]

Watkins is your first option. He can be hit and miss, but hopefully he will sort this one. I think you'll be fine Dot once table updated.

Bennyc I think you just supply your case, with the Facebook update as well as Twitter and one part of website. Remind him you're a journalist

When it's the final game and final ratings to decide money slots, must be taken more seriously than mid game annoyance when you lose a starman and slip to 34th from 28th for example.

[sleuth]

I think as much as Benny is worried they will change it to Suarez, I am as worried they will keep it as Iniesta.

What I can't seem them doing is paying out anymore than they need too. So as I say I don't have a clue which way this is going but it would be nice to get a reply from Mr Watkins with a final say on which way they are going.

[12345678]

i rarely post in fiso or read posts these days but will on this one.

1) edmo is right about the Gambling Commission. i believe they have no real interest in the integrity of the uk gambling industry in my experience. it isn't so much that they are just another useless uk regulatory body it is more that they see their job as collecting as much licensing revenue as possible.

2) watkins and robbins have been responsible for many farcical sdt decisions over the years and they now have gfm on board who illustrated their own integrity over last years mail debacle.

3) sdt have allegedly admitted using the starman and ratings system for fiddling at previous fiso meetings. i didn't attend so going on 2nd hand info.

4) re the con-tam-inator they used a program to hack into the sdt interface in order to pick multiple entries in every single minute, proven by the selection of players not even in the weekly lists. they clearly cheated the sdt t&c, which were amended to accommodate them which they then broke again. sdt still paid out despite legal action ensuing from those that felt cheated. presumably this was in order to retain the entry fees, rumoured to be around £50k. a large number of entries were seemingly made from HK where legislation suggested it was illegal to enter from.

5) all the while ratings and starmen are based upon random reporters views the game is easily manipulated and not based upon what actually happens on the pitch. just look at the ratings and starmen in different papers in the champions league final, the starmen varied and in some papers those selected as starmen in others were marked as below average performers in the game. unless something like opta stats are used given past history suspicion will always remain of fiddling (whereas it is probably largely ineptitude).

6) all the while watkins and robbins are involved it seems a bit similar to a blatter/warner axis to me in terms of trust. just a personal opinion given what i know and what i have been told second hand. the current rumpus is really just another incident of who knows what, most likely straightforward incompetence. i can remember years ago svensson scoring 2 goals but was only ever awarded 1 in the scoring, don't think that was ever changed, so as things stand the current foul up is pretty minor compared to that one.

7) sdt wins the ff stakes on prize money and is now a much better designed game, just think how good it would be if you could trust those running it and all scoring was based upon fact rather than we really don't know what.

8) the only way things will change in my personal view is something like a co-ordinated twitter storm, but in my experience most fantasy players are too frightened to do this for fear of being 'blacklisted' or simply don't care enough to do it.

9) now it comes to prizes being altered due to random or ineptly chosen starman people are up in arms but to be honest we all knew this was likely to happen again, it just hurts more if you are personally involved in the farce as those involved are finding out now. remember next time it could be you!

andy

[Backlash]

They've changed it for now..........

[12345678]

by the way my best guess is that they changed this one because suarez was a much better headline, in terms of profile, punchlines etc.

nothing to do with the game at all apart from changing leaderboard positions and likely nothing to do with fiddling either.

very much doubt we will ever know the truth of the matter.

very unlucky ben, you have my sympathy but it's part of dealing with sdt.

andy

[bennyc]

Statement due on DT website in the next couple of hours. Given the leaderboard has changed I think the writing is on the wall.

[12345678]

sorry ben but exclusive video reaction from the meeting at sdt hq (dots local pub) from watkins boss on being told about what has gone on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viLK8cMKUnY

[bennyc]

I called back the helpline at 4pm to say there was no sign of the promised statement on the website. Spoke to the same guy (Paul). He said the decision to change to Suarez was final and there wouldn't be a statement.

I asked why the star man had been changed and he said he wasn't privy to that information. I said that was unacceptable and asked to speak to a manager. He couldn't do that. Eventually he said 'look, the reporter changed his mind'. I asked him what prompted it and he repeated that phrase.

So that's it.

Congratulations to Dot. Commiserations to the poor sod who thought he'd won 2k and is now left with nothing.

The idea that a reporter can change his mind when his initial choice has been posted on social media and after the scores have been updated troubles me greatly. Who knows why it was done and who knows whether it will continue to happen.

Your only option is to vote with your feet and refuse to the play the most lucrative game by far. They know they are dominant and won't care if a few people take a stand.

[12345678]

Thats about the rub of it ben. Not surprised they refused to give an explanation. You look pretty stupid saying you robbed a paying entrant of 2k just to make it easier to write more pithy copy lets face it. The only thing you can do on your own is to complain over the heads of batman and robbins. I know ray still wants to hear them calling the bingo numbers

[sleuth]

Unlucky Dot - Suarez deserved star man - you should complain.

Tks for that footy.

He is now

I did

[sleuth]

Unlucky Dot - Suarez deserved star man - you should complain.

Tks for that footy.

He is now

I did

My only regret was my gain results in a smaller loss for Ben Carter.


I hope that this change results in transparency in the future, but I doubt it somehow..

[12345678]

fwiw i would have picked swarez starman as well.

the balance of reports i read would have suggested neither, but neymar.

thats why starman should play no part in ff scoring. far better to leave it out, or use opta if you must!

andy

[t.gridley]

Congratulations, Dot. The helpline have confirmed the table will be amended.

Not good for me - that decision has cost me £1000. Dropping from 4th to 5th.

The website last night clearly had Iniesta stated as starman and the newspaper have changed it. The chap on the help desk said the reporter does not have final say on the ratings - it's the newspaper.

I'll be contacting the Gambling Commission to complain. This is not the first time this has happened and the integrity of the game stinks.

Alright Benny, sorry to hear if it is changed that my gain is your loss. I' m sure you can see my grounds for complaining though and I think on the basis explained I'm more right than wrong in believing that Suarez appears,according the Sun, to be their MOTM.

Felt I was totally wronged on the Hazard situation and didn't want to let this one go when for all intents and purposes I'm more in the right than wrong.

If anything they should do a Maddog on this and perhaps pay out both, but to be honest they have altered enough ratings the last few months with no justification or explanation , hence the 17 changes in April in three consecutive games, two of which were CL games.
But on this occasion Starman is clearly stated on the net as SUAREZ and clearly shows the same in the paper today.

Either way I expect the gambling commission to be receiving a call.


Benny also please don't think I'm being pedantic but the table as it stands shows you are joint 4th so that would of meant 4th prize of £2,000 and 5th prize was £1,000 so if that were to remain the same you would of shared £3,000. £1,500 quid each.

If the table is altered to Suarez being STARMAN as the help desk confirmed then you would end up outright 5th which is £1,000 so the drop was £500 only.

My scenario is £2,000 or diddly squatt.

Well done Dot, partially makes up for the 5k that was taken from you in the weekly.

[plevna1963]

Hope they sort out this mess,could you imagine if this was between Winning/ or Finishing 2nd

[Ashers]

Hope they sort out this mess,could you imagine if this was between Winning/ or Finishing 2nd

It was for Sleuth.

[bloggie]

Hope they sort out this mess,could you imagine if this was between Winning/ or Finishing 2nd

It was for Sleuth.

True.