To see less ads Register or Login ----- Daily Fantasy Sports games 18+

Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

A forum for discussion on Football matters not involving fantasy issues.
User avatar
Zimmerman
FISO Jedi Knight
Posts: 30211
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:42
Location: having a picnic at the Bear Mountain

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Zimmerman »

DragonSwag wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 10:46 Lovren is technically great. Its his positioning and gamesense that are the issue.
Depends what you mean by technically?
Can’t read play
Can’t pass a ball
Can’t tackle
Can’t turn

So if you mean he’s quite tall and can sometimes head things (if direction isn’t a factor), then yes, technically he’s a gifted individual.

User avatar
Zimmerman
FISO Jedi Knight
Posts: 30211
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:42
Location: having a picnic at the Bear Mountain

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Zimmerman »

ZeroRemorse wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 11:02
DragonSwag wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 10:46 Lovren is technically great. Its his positioning to and gamesense that are the issue.
Lovren is pretty bad in the air.

I hear he takes a cocktail of painkillers before matches. Probably plays a large part in his lack of form.
Did you see the twitter exchange with Didi Hamman?
Journalist: Lovren is taking 5 pills to get through each game
Didi: I’m taking 8 to watch him

User avatar
jacksosi
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 4678
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:28
FS Record: TFF : 87th 06/07 ; FPL 1401st 08/09 ; 5AS champions 21/22 🔫🍸

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by jacksosi »


User avatar
ZeroRemorse
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 2181
Joined: 12 Aug 2016, 15:29

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by ZeroRemorse »

Ruthless!!!! :lol: :lol:

User avatar
forestfan
FISO Jedi Knight
Posts: 36694
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:27
Location: Between Westeros and Nova Scotia
FS Record: FISODAS Champion Season 34!

Re: Virgil van Dijk to join Liverpool on 1 January for £75m

Post by forestfan »

There’s always been plenty of crap games, the thing about sport is that it’s not scripted unlike other forms of entertainment, which can be both a positive and a negative.

There are too many teams opting for trying not to lose or mere damage limitation against better teams these days though... and single-leg knockout format matches are usually cagey which has reduced the entertainment value of international tournaments and domestic cups.

User avatar
blahblah
FISO Viscount
Posts: 108833
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:46
Location: .. he thinks that he knows something which he doesn't, whereas I am quite concious of my ignorance.

Re: Transfer News

Post by blahblah »

Zimmerman wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 08:34
Black caviar wrote: 27 Dec 2017, 17:23 The world has gone mad. Go to a show, always entertained, go to a musical always entertained
You’ve obviously never been to see The Snowman at the Peacock Theatre.
Is that a euphemism?

Gambit
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 3427
Joined: 02 Nov 2014, 16:36

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Gambit »

Southampton have looked much better without VVD, they had 4 clean sheets in the first 6 games without VVD, he came back in GW7 and they had 1 clean sheet in 10 or 11 games with him in the team.

He's not a bad player but the way Liverpool pour forward and empty the midfield he's going to be really exposed and I think he'll be found wanting. Maguire and Tarkowski are the players they should've gone for, 75m on VVD is ridiculous.

User avatar
ZeroRemorse
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 2181
Joined: 12 Aug 2016, 15:29

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by ZeroRemorse »

Are you just going to forget the past few seasons and use that small sample after a summer transfer saga that left him pretty angry with SOTON and unmotivated?

I agree 75m on VVD is ridiculous, so Klopp must value him more than any other player in his managerial career and Klopps judgment has proven to be one of the best of this footballing generation. But, knowing LFC's luck he's probably injury prone now :shock: :lol:

Gambit
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 3427
Joined: 02 Nov 2014, 16:36

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Gambit »

we'll just have to agree to differ, I don't think he'll make that much difference and certainly not 75m worth, and I maintain that Maguire is better.

As for Klopp's judgement being one of the best this footballing generation? :D Salah and Mane were exceptional buys, the rest nothing special, and you'd think with this awesome judging power he'd have a better Liverpool record than Brendon Rodgers......oh wait :lol:

User avatar
forestfan
FISO Jedi Knight
Posts: 36694
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:27
Location: Between Westeros and Nova Scotia
FS Record: FISODAS Champion Season 34!

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by forestfan »

baganboy wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 05:36
ZeroRemorse wrote: 27 Dec 2017, 21:58
Ruth_NZ wrote: 27 Dec 2017, 21:49 I really don't know why Liverpool don't get someone like Schmeichel. He's a classy GK and he's not a shrinking violet. You could do a lot worse.
Peter would never allow such a move, unless Kasper wants to have Christmas's alone :lol:
When I was 31 years of age, if I were about to make a change of workplace, my dad would not have too much of an influence on me. Would Kasper's? Would yours?

Also if I may add, there's a reason why Kasper is a Man City Academy graduate. :)
It's not quite the same as joining Sainsbury's if your Dad worked at Tesco :wink:

United-Liverpool clearly has a level of animosity far beyond that of United-City.

User avatar
Zimmerman
FISO Jedi Knight
Posts: 30211
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:42
Location: having a picnic at the Bear Mountain

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Zimmerman »

I think it’s a bit of a misnomer that Liverpool wantingly pour forward or play gung ho football.

They play without an orthodox DM but they compensate for that with the two or three CMs and the pressing game.

Most of Liverpool’s frailties stem from ridiculously poor players/decision making. One less clown should alleviate some of those silly lapses.

Gambit
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 3427
Joined: 02 Nov 2014, 16:36

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Gambit »

Zimmerman wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 15:31 I think it’s a bit of a misnomer that Liverpool wantingly pour forward or play gung ho football.

They play without an orthodox DM but they compensate for that with the two or three CMs and the pressing game.

Most of Liverpool’s frailties stem from ridiculously poor players/decision making. One less clown should alleviate some of those silly lapses.
I disagree, it's why their games are some of the best to watch, they often resemble 4th quarter basket ball games with a you attack we attack attitude. Fantastic entertainment.

User avatar
Zimmerman
FISO Jedi Knight
Posts: 30211
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:42
Location: having a picnic at the Bear Mountain

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Zimmerman »

A CB that can’t read play or turn and a keeper that can’t catch tend to have that effect on a game.

Look at the effect Ederson has had for City.
Look at Spurs minus Walker (or with Aurier) and without Alderweireld.... the teams haven’t changed their style
Of play yet have enjoyed different fortunes because of the the change in personnel.

User avatar
baganboy
Comfortably Dumb(ledore)
Posts: 5874
Joined: 05 Aug 2008, 06:59
FS Record: 2011/12 - 212. 2019/20 - 222.
Altogether 6 top 10Ks. 8 top 20Ks. 9 top 50Ks.

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by baganboy »

forestfan wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 15:27
baganboy wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 05:36
ZeroRemorse wrote: 27 Dec 2017, 21:58
Ruth_NZ wrote: 27 Dec 2017, 21:49 I really don't know why Liverpool don't get someone like Schmeichel. He's a classy GK and he's not a shrinking violet. You could do a lot worse.
Peter would never allow such a move, unless Kasper wants to have Christmas's alone :lol:
When I was 31 years of age, if I were about to make a change of workplace, my dad would not have too much of an influence on me. Would Kasper's? Would yours?

Also if I may add, there's a reason why Kasper is a Man City Academy graduate. :)
It's not quite the same as joining Sainsbury's if your Dad worked at Tesco :wink:

United-Liverpool clearly has a level of animosity far beyond that of United-City.
Why would Kasper care? He is anyway a City youth product.

User avatar
baganboy
Comfortably Dumb(ledore)
Posts: 5874
Joined: 05 Aug 2008, 06:59
FS Record: 2011/12 - 212. 2019/20 - 222.
Altogether 6 top 10Ks. 8 top 20Ks. 9 top 50Ks.

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by baganboy »

Zimmerman wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 15:31 I think it’s a bit of a misnomer that Liverpool wantingly pour forward or play gung ho football.

They play without an orthodox DM but they compensate for that with the two or three CMs and the pressing game.

Most of Liverpool’s frailties stem from ridiculously poor players/decision making. One less clown should alleviate some of those silly lapses.
Agreed.
Klopp's Dortmund at its best played with Sahin, Gundogan, one of the Bender twins and the likes. Not pure defensive midfielders, but a whole lot better in understanding the defensive side of the game than Milner, Henderson and the likes, who are pure box-to-box midfielders, who can tackle but hardly shield the defence.
Only Can can, perhaps... can he?

User avatar
baganboy
Comfortably Dumb(ledore)
Posts: 5874
Joined: 05 Aug 2008, 06:59
FS Record: 2011/12 - 212. 2019/20 - 222.
Altogether 6 top 10Ks. 8 top 20Ks. 9 top 50Ks.

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by baganboy »

PS: again, trying to construct Klopp's best team - VVD is a decent approximation to Hummels. Controlled on the ball, big, not slow, and good at both attacking and defensive headers.

Gambit
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 3427
Joined: 02 Nov 2014, 16:36

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Gambit »

Zimmerman wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 15:40 A CB that can’t read play or turn and a keeper that can’t catch tend to have that effect on a game.

Look at the effect Ederson has had for City.
Look at Spurs minus Walker (or with Aurier) and without Alderweireld.... the teams haven’t changed their style
Of play yet have enjoyed different fortunes because of the the change in personnel.
City games didn't often play like basketball games the way Liverpool games do, it was just the keeper conceded pretty much any shot he faced :)

Firmino puts in a serious amount of work, but Mane/Salah/Coutinho aren't too concerned with their defensive duties, and then you have Robertson and Gomez/TAA breaking forward, and Chamberlain etc. It's great to watch. I think they are gung ho and from all the big teams they are the ones if they were 3-0 up I would say are less likely to just see it out. Chelsea and United try to shut up shop, City do it by just passing teams to death and keeping the ball, Liverpool keep attacking, it's refreshing to see. Out of all the teams in the league I think Liverpool are the most attack minded. Maybe Arsenal at times. Who do you think are the most gung ho in the PL?

Even Klopp calls his style Heavy Metal! :D

User avatar
Tall Paul
Dumbledore
Posts: 7517
Joined: 27 Aug 2008, 12:57

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Tall Paul »

ZeroRemorse wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 14:50Klopps judgment has proven to be one of the best of this footballing generation.
Klopp gave Mignolet a five year contract :lol:

Gambit
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 3427
Joined: 02 Nov 2014, 16:36

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Gambit »

Tall Paul wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 16:06
ZeroRemorse wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 14:50Klopps judgment has proven to be one of the best of this footballing generation.
Klopp gave Mignolet a five year contract :lol:
ha :shock: :lol:

User avatar
Pulpy
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 1652
Joined: 20 Jan 2015, 18:41

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Pulpy »

One thing Vin Dijk will add to Liverpool is someone capable of getting on the end of corners and free kicks. Ominously that means he may slightly increase Coutinho (if he stays) and Salah's points potential.

User avatar
blahblah
FISO Viscount
Posts: 108833
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:46
Location: .. he thinks that he knows something which he doesn't, whereas I am quite concious of my ignorance.

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by blahblah »

Gambit wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 16:15
Tall Paul wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 16:06
ZeroRemorse wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 14:50Klopps judgment has proven to be one of the best of this footballing generation.
Klopp gave Mignolet a five year contract :lol:
ha :shock: :lol:
Indeedy....

User avatar
FingerPass
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 1119
Joined: 03 Jun 2006, 19:03
Location: Kung Fu School
FS Record: Pick Quick Champion 13/14 & 15/16, 5AS Europa League Champion (1. FC Köln) 17/18, 5AS H2H Champion (1. FC Köln) 18/19

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by FingerPass »

As a Liverpool fan, I'm pretty happy with this transfer... and the reaction to this transfer almost feels like carbon copy of the reaction to when Mane was signed (just replace 'Van Dijk' with 'Mane' and '£75m' with '35m').

There were a lot of defender names thrown around in the summer as players that Liverpool 'should' buy instead of VVD but they all seemed to be defenders suited to playing in a low block defence. I know Southampton are quite a defensive team as well but VVD has always seemed like an an aggressive 'front-foot' defender to me which is important to how Klopp wants to play.

A lot has already been said about Liverpool's attacking football but I don't think people understand just how terrible a player like Lovren can be for this style of play. As has been noted, Liverpool can play 80% of a game with 'good defence' and then just capitulate. And the problem isn't just that Liverpool concede a goal, it's that when they concede, a 2nd or 3rd goal usually quickly follows.

I think a big part of the problem is that at the first sign of danger, Lovren (and Klaven)'s first instinct is to drop deep which is the antithesis of what Klopp wants as it either drags the rest of the team back or it exacerbates the gap between the CBs and the FBs (a common criticism of Liverpool's defence is that the FBs are 'too attacking' - I think that's focusing on the wrong bit as they're meant to be attacking... I think it's the CBs that drop too deep). When Matip was first signed, he came with the notion that he was an aggressive ball playing centre back and that seemed to be pretty much what we got. It was really noticeable to me in the first few weeks of last season how often Matip would look across the line and make a 'push up' gesture with his hands only to be followed by an exasperated look when Lovren inevitably dropped back. He quickly gave up on that idea and now just follows Lovren to try and compensate for whatever harebrained adventure he decides to go on that day. It used to be even worse with Skrtel as he would back off and back off and back off... until he was practically standing on the keeper's toes!

Klopp's transfer record has also been brought up - all his 'big-money' signings (even stretching back to his Dortmund days) look pretty damn good to me. The rest are either on the 'wait and see' list and/or cost less then £5m anyway.


The other issue people seem to have is with the 'huge' price-tag. It's like everyone's forgot there was a massive new tv deal and all transfer prices skyrocketed. I think peoples heads are still stuck in 'old money' and struggling to deal with the fact that every player practically doubled in price overnight. I think part of the problem is that fees generally increased gradually previously but this one was a huge jump.

From BBC:

Image

In 'old money' I would say Van Dijk would be about £30-£35m which seems to be what most people are saying he should cost, but again I think that people just haven't adjusted to the new market.

I also see a lot of comparisons to the Rio Ferdinand transfer in terms of price - except people are saying hes not worth it as hes not as good as Ferdinand. I would argue that this is an incorrect comparison, as again people aren't adjusting to the new market. People just think, "Blimey, £75m is a lot" and aren't placing it relative to the rest of the current market. I don't think Van Dijk's £75m is even close to Ferdinands £30m when looking relative to this summers transfers.

I think people forget that the big thing about £30m for Ferdinand wasn't just that it was a huge amount of money but that it also dwarfed just about every other transfer going at that time. Here's the rest of that summer's transfers in the Premier League:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_E ... ummer_2002

The next highest was Anelka at £13m (!)

Here is this summer for comparison:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_E ... ummer_2017

Looking relative to other transfers, I would say a 'Ferdinand equivalent' transfer in the current market would be looking at northwards of £170m.

Also, in all the articles I'm reading the media are desperate to drive home the fact the Liverpool have 'smashed' their club record transfer 3 or 4 times this season as if to accentuate the notion that Liverpool are spending 'crazily' and have overpaid - but that would ignore the fact that just about everyone is doing this.

In fact, a quick google tells me that 14 of the 20 Premier League clubs broke their club record this summer (4 of whom broke it multiple times), and the remaining 6 includes the 2 Manchester Clubs because they already set big records in a previous window. This was only the first window where everyone was flush with TV cash too so I suspect club record transfers will continue to be broken.

PS: Did anybody bother reading this ridiculously long post?

User avatar
Magic
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 2390
Joined: 16 Jul 2017, 08:29
FS Record: Improving

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by Magic »

ZeroRemorse wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 10:11
Magic wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 09:20
Ruth_NZ wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 01:37VVD is a fair bit better than Lovren though. :lol:
Not that much better. He's quite overrated.
Nah. Statistically he's on another planet and technically.

And it's no coincidence SOTON defence has turned to custard in his absence.
You know what they say about stats...

User avatar
ZeroRemorse
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 2181
Joined: 12 Aug 2016, 15:29

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by ZeroRemorse »

blahblah wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 17:59
Gambit wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 16:15
Tall Paul wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 16:06
ZeroRemorse wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 14:50Klopps judgment has proven to be one of the best of this footballing generation.
Klopp gave Mignolet a five year contract :lol:
ha :shock: :lol:
Indeedy....
And SAF let Pogba go on a free.

Even the greats make a few mistakes. It doesn't make all their other decisions worthless.

User avatar
DarkStyles
Red & Blue Braces
Posts: 360
Joined: 04 Dec 2017, 10:11
FS Record: Long time player, Won Euro 2016 Dream Team Works League

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by DarkStyles »

The negative with VVD is that mignolet will still play. Just don't trust him.

The Real Slim Shady
Dumbledore
Posts: 8753
Joined: 19 Jan 2010, 01:21
Location: Los Angeles, CA
FS Record: 1,465th in FPL 05/06
Contact:

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by The Real Slim Shady »

75m hahahahahahahaha.

User avatar
math!
Dumbledore
Posts: 6819
Joined: 01 Aug 2015, 03:30
FS Record: Yes

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by math! »

ZeroRemorse wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 19:14
blahblah wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 17:59
Gambit wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 16:15
Tall Paul wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 16:06
ZeroRemorse wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 14:50Klopps judgment has proven to be one of the best of this footballing generation.
Klopp gave Mignolet a five year contract :lol:
ha :shock: :lol:
Indeedy....
And SAF let Pogba go on a free.

Even the greats make a few mistakes. It doesn't make all their other decisions worthless.
At least Man Utd got Pogba back. Meanwhile KDB is running the show at City while Salah is scoring for fun :x

User avatar
pulpfiction
Grumpy Old Man
Posts: 1031
Joined: 17 Jul 2015, 15:21
FS Record: 2nd in phase dream team europe, 3rd november manager of the month

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by pulpfiction »

What a waste of 75m.

I could buy Lindisfarne for that. :lol:

User avatar
murf
FISO Viscount
Posts: 109610
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 18:28
Location: here
FS Record: Once led TFF. Very briefly.
Contact:

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by murf »

pulpfiction wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 22:32 What a waste of 75m.

I could buy Lindisfarne for that. :lol:

They must all be about 80 by now. Never any good at defending either, even with Gazza in front of them.

User avatar
ragamuffin
Treebeard
Posts: 264
Joined: 17 Mar 2016, 10:52
FS Record: good

Re: Virgil Van Dijk joins LFC for 75m

Post by ragamuffin »

ZeroRemorse wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 11:02
DragonSwag wrote: 28 Dec 2017, 10:46 Lovren is technically great. Its his positioning and gamesense that are the issue.
Lovren is pretty bad in the air.

I hear he takes a cocktail of painkillers before matches. Probably plays a large part in his lack of form.
What for?

View Latest: 1 Day View Your posts
Post Reply

Return to “Football Talk & Events”