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Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

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superiorpinkham
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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by superiorpinkham » 16 Apr 2019, 06:59

So basically you're saying it's okay for the Byrom tag team to carry on cheating?

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Scotty 2051 » 16 Apr 2019, 07:54

Well my wife and daughters will definitely play next season then if that’s the case.
I might even get my mum to have a go even though she doesn’t have broadband 😀

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by 12345678 » 16 Apr 2019, 12:10

superiorpinkham wrote:
16 Apr 2019, 06:59
So basically you're saying it's okay for the Byrom tag team to carry on cheating?
i know mick's son has his own views as i used to join in a forum they were both on.

if you read what i said instead of putting words into my mouth i made it very clear that my view was that those running the game, which doesn't include the 'holier than thou' brigade nor the 'cheats' seem to largely accept that limited entry comps are limited to entries per ID.

I also stated/implied that the reason for this is that the aim of making a comp limited entry seems to be to avoid an early season 'dominated' leaderboard by a front runner getting off to a flier. Using a different ID to gain further entries does not negate this aim.

I was quizzed on this by my old friend and occasional bridge partner from the past david browne aka 'striker'. he said to me 'you were one of the most ethical bridge players i knew, how can you condone multi entering in limited entry comps?' My reply to him was 'when i played bridge i played according to the interpretation of the rules by those running the game, with FF i view it the same way, so no longer have a problem with anyone multi entering now they have clarified their position through practice,' or words to that effect.

So the short answer is no i don't consider mick (or all the well known fiso members who do it) is 'cheating' and therefore have no problem with it.

As i said in the post if you read through it i would rather the providers did not allow entries from wives and girlfriends etc but can see issues with enforcing it. at what point does it become someone else's team? fiso members ask each other for help, one side game you all start off with the same team picked by someone else. it can potentially be difficult to pick out 'cheats'. as i said above mick's son is definitely actively involved in FF, he no doubt gets advice from mick and probably argues against it at times and fails to follow it too.

Personally i would rather there was 'no limit' solving the whole problem from the FF communities point of view. The trouble with that is that a transfer burning front runner off to a flier can dominate the leaderboard for a while which is not what the providers want to see!

The bottom line is that those responsible for enforcing the rules have proven time and time again that these comps are run on the basis of entries per ID, if you don't like it complain to them and say why, i know i have and it has made no difference!

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superiorpinkham
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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by superiorpinkham » 16 Apr 2019, 12:23

So Byrom's son is a cheat too?

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by 12345678 » 16 Apr 2019, 12:33

superiorpinkham wrote:
16 Apr 2019, 12:23
So Byrom's son is a cheat too?
that is not my opinion, i made that perfectly clear, if it is yours you are fully entitled to it.

i have no problem with you disagreeing with me.

i do have a problem if you misrepresent what i am saying.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by leethomas » 16 Apr 2019, 13:07

Unfortunately after being singled out and slandered on here this will be my last fiso post.
A lot of people are slandering my name when they know nothing about me or my wife. I keep hearing 99% i am running my wifes team because i play the game and i am on fiso. The FACTS of the matter are these, ive stated many times, if i wanted more teams and not bring any attention to myself it would be very easily done with a male account of a mate or family member with a different surname but as stated i dont want to run more than 10. This is probably going on and some people also maybe running more than 10 teams using their familys accounts, wives, sons, daughters but i don't. Also there are also probably many syndicates about but the truth of the matter is as my wife is doing well for the first time ever ( after having a dreamteam account for years) muppets have come on here to slander me and being completly honest upset the other half too which as brought me to post this final message.
These are the FACTS, i do not manage my wifes account, lorraine has had an account for years and as played dreamteam for years. The people that matter at dreamteam will know this as i had one team in my account she has had one in hers to play in a works league for years too, so the 99% certainty off people that she doesnt play and i run her teams i believe shows more like 99% that lorraine plays and has done for years. Or was i opening an account in her name years a go when it was payed for so in the future if it goes to 10 free teams i can use them ( thats sarcasm for the muppets )
Last year i finished top 10 in world cup. I entered 10 teams, FACT. Lorraine entered 3. I said to her why have you only entered 3 when its free, you could have chucked 10 in and got lucky with one. Surely the cheat i am would of entered the other 7. ( again thats sarcasm) Again, the people who matter at sun dreamteam will know this too.
This season i did say to her enter 10, if you get one doing well in main game and work team is rubbish you will still have interest.
Again these are facts which some got deleted, i stated early in season to Dot, she had hazard in neither of her 2 teams doing quite well, did i try and advise her to put him in one, yes i did, did she, no she didn't for 5 or 6 weeks. Did i take more of an interest in her 2 teams doing well, yes i did, does she manage her teams, yes she does, did she ask me for advice on a mid, yes she did, i said for upto that limit id go gundagon or moura, (not just a casual i mentioned moura in passing as someone stated) did she take advice, yes she did, she asked what striker id put in, my answer was firmino or son, did she take my advice, no she didnt, she put a very poor choice of lukaku in both her teams imo. She manages her own teams and has done for years. Id like to think ive helped her with what ive learnt, blocks etc plus i have also give my opinion who will start in the blocks ( not always right) As ive stated the people at sun dreamteam are the ones who matter, not the ones slandering on here when they know nothing. One post says, we must put a stop to this now, you do know that you are saying lets put a stop to women playing dont ya, i'm not playing the sexist card or spitting dummy out but THAT IS what you are saying. Instead of hiding behind pretend names put your real names on here. It's easy coming on shouting whatever you want when nobody knows who you are. Slandering my name and upsetting the better half is the reason i wont be posting again.

So in summary for people who are a bit slow.

1. Lorraine plays dream team, she has for years
2. I do not manage Lorraines teams.
3. I have taken an interest in her teams, given advice, some taken, some not as she manages her teams.
4. Incredible that a cheat like me didnt use rest of lorraines world cup allocated teams.

Just a good luck message to ken and blade, good luck to ya both, hope ya get a decent payout kenny you've smashed it this year. Top team that at top.

Met some great lads on here and do keep in touch with some, Cheers to everyone who has ran enjoyable tourneys including jeff, cbn, backlash plus others and also everyone who has put their hard earned dosh into sponsoring prizes. If i enter any next year it will be via pm.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by 12345678 » 16 Apr 2019, 13:28

sorry to hear that lee,

unfortunately this is the consequence of the providers saying the rules are one thing but applying them in a completely different manner in practice!

i did try to persuade providers to take a cyki 'heuristic' approach at the end of the season but they refused.

we now find ourselves in a situation where we know multi entries are allowed so you either play at a disadvantage to them or you play the rules as interpreted in practise by the providers.

i don't like it but it is where we are now with limited entry comps.

those enforcing the rules pay out to multi entries, therefore in their view it is allowed.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Scotty 2051 » 16 Apr 2019, 14:04

You know someone is lying when they go on and on and on and on and on :mrgreen:

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12345678
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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by 12345678 » 16 Apr 2019, 14:22

Scotty 2051 wrote:
16 Apr 2019, 14:04
You know someone is lying when they go on and on and on and on and on :mrgreen:
psychology research was you know someone has no successful argument when they try and blacken anyone's character who disagrees with them instead of arguing their case.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Yorkshire Exile » 16 Apr 2019, 14:38

I think the fact Lorraine is in the mix is what focuses attention back on this issue rather than being about you per se lee.
The 'fact' is that this form of cheating is endemic (but not limited to) on here. It is obviously most rife where entries are limited, some admit they do it (fair play eg ronny), other deny through legitimate reasons (eg Lee) but others keep their head down lest the spotlight gets shined in their direction.. In the past some eg crookface were hounded from here on the basis of his missus winning a second tff monthly (when it was capped at 1 per player). It is the double standards which irk most.... Especially when players who are not regulars (or even on here) are called out.... Eg see sun weekender, but there are notables year on year in tff where I tend to focus my efforts with the Ashalls, Frickers etc.

I have sympathy if you have a missus who genuinely plays as it does raise the obvious questions. My better half has zero interest - although that does tend to change about this time of year if there is a sniff of any cash :D
Don't cheat folks there is enough skill and nous in these parts to win without resorting to it.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by ronny10 » 16 Apr 2019, 14:57

Hey, I didnt admit anything. I said I got my mrs playing because it's free to play so why wouldn't you. I narrow down her player options via a spreadsheet for ease of use based on fixtures, form, injury etc. The very same I use for my teams. I told her how to approach it from the start and give advice when required.

If anything its actually improved our relationship as she doesn't moan as much about the footy being on all the time :D


Anyway, I wont be dragged into this, people can make their own minds up about myself, Lee or anyone, it's their opinion and not something I'm particularly bothered about!

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by summer is over » 16 Apr 2019, 17:20

Firstly, and this isn’t a petty point but something is a bit of a bugbear of mine, Slander is a spoken word so anything posted on here defaming your name is libelling your name, or making libellous accusations not slandering. :D

There is no need to stop posting just because someone asks the question that most people are thinking anyway, you simply deny it and move on and people are left to make up their own minds, though it’s unprovable how many teams your wife entered into the World Cup comp now I’d imagine?

I might be wrong but the Sun do seem to have some checks in place, for example Margaret Quiqley is absent from the comp this year whereas last year she was doing very well alongside Eoghan Quigley at the top of the leaderboard? Maybe they ‘had a word’.

If you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to fear because the rules stat you’re allowed more than 1 entrant per household, I am assuming the Quigley were obviously being controlled by one person because of the time/dates of teams entered/transfers made from the same device?

ANYWAY, people are entitled to be suspicious, 100k is a lot of money and if people feel/suspect there is collusion they should be allowed to say, what I find amusing is there are some players like the Byroms who are always singled out as working together, yet other wags who are well liked fiso posters are not, because they’re well liked fiso posters.

What was posted yesterday is well worth posting again, isn’t it funny when the game was a paid game that you never saw the wives of the well established, well respected, seasoned elite players on the leaderboards, now you’re limited to 10 they’re there, either in the seasonal comp or the weekender. That’s quite telling.

The only way to combat collusion or accusations of collusion is to bring back the paid game and have max entries of 500, if people want to enter that many then that’s their money and their time, which would be a full time job.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by 12345678 » 16 Apr 2019, 17:44

good comments from the last 3. i would point out that a lot of the issues i see and encounter on here seem to be from more frequent posters from another forum. if you look at the tff chairmans leader board you will see lots of manufactured leagues clearly aimed solely at gaining an entry to that chairmans prize (which personally i think is outdated and should go to 2nd prize which is desperately low). i don't really see much difference tbh, although i have no problem with anyone begging to differ.

it's a shame to see malicious comments still allowed and many members who used to contribute positively now inactive and members like lee saying enough is enough.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Zimmerman » 16 Apr 2019, 17:57

It’s a fine between allowing free speech and fair criticism and being accused of operating a Freemasons or clique.

You can’t please all the people all of the time (or ever, it seems).

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Yorkshire Exile » 16 Apr 2019, 18:01

I beg to differ with that one Andy. In one sense I'm the architect of the collective effort at the vip chairs league.
We also do it with an understanding that 50% of winnings go to charity. In the last few years we have donated several thousand pounds to great ormond Street hospital where my son is still an outpatient after 6 years having had 2 ops age 5 months old.
Some may feel our efforts are unsporting but they are definitely within the rules and do help to get the forum working together....

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Zimmerman » 16 Apr 2019, 18:05

Oooo there’s another shade of grey on the palette.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Yorkshire Exile » 16 Apr 2019, 18:22

Zimmerman wrote:
16 Apr 2019, 18:05
Oooo there’s another shade of grey on the palette.
no there isn't
viewtopic.php?f=136&t=128965

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by 12345678 » 16 Apr 2019, 18:24

Yorkshire Exile wrote:
16 Apr 2019, 18:01
I beg to differ with that one Andy. In one sense I'm the architect of the collective effort at the vip chairs league.
We also do it with an understanding that 50% of winnings go to charity. In the last few years we have donated several thousand pounds to great ormond Street hospital where my son is still an outpatient after 6 years having had 2 ops age 5 months old.
Some may feel our efforts are unsporting but they are definitely within the rules and do help to get the forum working together....
you make your lot sound like robin hood rather than robbing hood!

what you do with the money is your choice but if one of you wins it deprives the chairman of a genuine league of the money. they may of course be rich or poor.

as you say it has been allowed despite obviously being against the spirit of the prize, exactly what some will argue has happened in sdt. i don't have a problem with you disagreeing, you have always been one of the more decent crowd over there but i don't personally see the difference and what is done with the money is irrelevant.

you also have probably the biggest ever multi entrant amongst your number and the main critic of multi entering (assuming they are still about). the latter who's other half used to enter all the limited entry comps but none of the others! didn't they also have a very close relationship?

the comments above about certain people being targetted whilst others are not is very true and it is a shame to see that agenda.

as others have said above people can make their own minds up.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Yorkshire Exile » 16 Apr 2019, 18:35

"you also have probably the biggest ever multi entrant amongst your number and the main critic of multi entering (assuming they are still about). the latter who's other half used to enter all the limited entry comps but none of the others! didn't they also have a very close relationship?"


genuinely don't know who you mean here...

I don't see the vip chairs approach any different to coralling friends via Facebook etc but like you say we can disagree on that. We are just a bit more organised than the fiso effort on this one...

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Vid » 16 Apr 2019, 18:42

Yorkshire Exile wrote:
15 Apr 2019, 22:36
Vid wrote:
15 Apr 2019, 17:17
Yorkshire Exile wrote:
14 Apr 2019, 12:56
where did all yesterdays posts go???

:roll:
A pity that no-one cared to notify me of any potential issues in this forum, I will be looking into the matter as and when I can over the next few days.

There is a process in place, if you don't like what the mods are doing then don't post about it, get my attention directly!
Thought the mods would know which mod deleted... Also wouldn't want to question a mod and get a ban :roll: Also wasn't aware there was any issues until stuff got deleted etc
Having investigated as best as I can, a mod came across a series of posts that infringed the forum rules, due to ongoing issues with mod tools (several months now) he felt that he had no choice other than to delete these posts. There is no way to recover these posts, they are gone forever. I trust his judgement in this matter, maybe one or two posts could have been removed and others edited, this was not an option for him, so he followed his only option at the time. Unfortunate, but these things do happen very rarely.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Yorkshire Exile » 16 Apr 2019, 18:44

Fair enough. One or two were a bit touchy but many were in good spirit etc....

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by ronny10 » 16 Apr 2019, 19:06

I didn't think there was much wrong with them either, I'm all for equal accusations :D

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Zimmerman » 16 Apr 2019, 19:10

You still only dating girls who have men’s names?

How are Stevie, Vyvian and Mel. You still amicable?

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by 12345678 » 16 Apr 2019, 19:20

so yorkshire that person responsible for the largest multi entry i can recall in a limited entry game had an entry in his mrs name from what i recall (could be a family member) recently in the top 100 in sdt.

it is now in the top 200 yet i don't see that multi being targeted like lee has been and the biggest critic of multis in your forum had a very close relationship with him didn't they.

i can't recall robin hood keeping 50% of any cash he nicked (which was only from the rich) for himself maybe that was robbing hood ;)

i'm just fed up with seeing extreme hypocrites in action.

as i say personally if those running the comps allow it then it is allowed. they call the shots, they run the game, they pay out. so no i don't personally have a problem with it, but those that pick on the likes of lee need to look at this a bit more widely!

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Yorkshire Exile » 16 Apr 2019, 19:28

Deano/ cheetah / submit.... The infamous hare
He's on here as Gooner66 I think now. Not really been around for a few years now but he's a good bloke. I've still called him out as cheating on here and over there and don't care if I know him - it's still cheating..and he knows I would say it to him... .. Lilibeth etc... I will try find post.....

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Yorkshire Exile » 16 Apr 2019, 19:38

Yorkshire Exile wrote:
04 Oct 2018, 22:40
And just to prove it ain't just people I don't know I call out.... And who I have just been having banter with on another thread.....

There is a post here which hints at the origins of others who have made appearances on sky and sun leader board this year.

http://www.fiso.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.p ... 6#p1981416

--------

The hypocrisy is what I don't like.

Sandor / quigley /byrom /prosser / crook face have been vilified on here over years at the same time many on here have been blatantly cheating themselves.

New players whilst I can admit to being condescending towards cos of their inability just to learn and take decisions for themselves don't realise what they are up against when experienced players are running multiple teams and cleaning up some of the major prizes....

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by 12345678 » 16 Apr 2019, 19:46

thats a bit different from the earlier 'genuinely don't know who you mean'.

personally i felt he did us all a favour by bringing the matter to a head. eventually they decided not to disqualify and it was firmly established it was allowed.

therefore i don't really sympathise with the 'holier than thou' approach taken by some.

they are not running the game, sdt are and they allow it as being within the rules.

god knows why! :lol: but that is a different matter.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Yorkshire Exile » 16 Apr 2019, 19:54

12345678 wrote:
16 Apr 2019, 19:46
thats a bit different from the earlier 'genuinely don't know who you mean'.

personally i felt he did us all a favour by bringing the matter to a head. eventually they decided not to disqualify and it was firmly established it was allowed.

therefore i don't really sympathise with the 'holier than thou' approach taken by some.

they are not running the game, sdt are and they allow it as being within the rules.

god knows why! :lol: but that is a different matter.
I didn't know who you were referring to. I never played the mail and didn't know him at the time. He did hold his hands up I think.. But why he's at it again is beyond me and probably related to him seeing others getting away with it... Dunno really... Can't speak for him

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Backlash » 16 Apr 2019, 20:01

Sad to see you go Lee, but how much can a man take?

It seems York Star isn’t whiter than white either :lol: albeit for charitable contributions 🙄

I’ve had my one of my children in and out of Great Ormand Street too and find that counter argument frankly insulting.

What’s the difference between unsporting behaviour vs cheating.....eff off!

On another note I’m all up for freedom of speech too but am never keen on newbie posters jumping in hiding behind a generic email possibly having multi accounts....I hope this is something FISO can clamp down on as I know there’s been a case recently where a forum had to legally produce details of a particularly rancid member so the police could press charges.

I know nothing has happened to that degree here but what with the continued rhetoric of hatred and increasing number of keyboard warriors this may need to be addressed so there is at least some sort of recourse.

I must say 12345678 has the best take, understanding and overall judgement on this and I totally agree it does nothing in a positive way for a positive forum.

If anyone has a problem I’d suggest like 12345678 you contact the respective providers and lay your accusations that way, doing it here making unfounded allegations makes you look like an absolute tit and will have no actual results.

This thread will no doubt go round and round so it’ll be the last time I visit it and hope Lee changes his mind and just skips certain moronic threads too.

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Re: Cheats, WaGs and the grey area in between

Post by Yorkshire Exile » 16 Apr 2019, 20:06

Backlash... Sorry you feel use of gosh was unnecessary..... Probably so.... Anyhow whatever the case you'll know what a good place it is.. And whatever you were there for I hope all is well

I make a distinction between t&cs which state you can't control someone else's team for games where there are restricted entries and vip chairman's league in tff where there is no rules to say how many leagues you can chair nor how many teams you enter

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