Weirdly was looking at this old thread; ytm-staff-helpful-t10334.html

How strange it is that in 2005/06, they had over 97,000 teams entered using block transfer windows....we had a little debate back then on the game and now their numbers have plumetted to a new all term low. I think you need to give it another shot YTM and go back to the trusted format. It was making you a fortune and The Sun shows that block transfer windows work!

Striker was asking for anytime transfers and my god did it work for him. Strange looking back to know he would go on and become a winner this way without knowing he would do so!! It's a strange old world!

The thing is YTM, I played because I wanted to play a skill only points game (no ratings) and it being as easy as just doing a few transfer windows. I think a lot of others that used to play wanted the same thing, yet the game persisted to use any time transfers and it really did suffer!?! Would be nice to have a debate on this as we haven't done for a long time and now we see the numbers dwindled, would love to see what others think!!

I'm not a fan of block transfer windows (I wonder why ), mainly because it doesn't suit the way I prefer to play but I do understand for those who can't devote the time to it

To be fair to YTM I think they have tried to tweak the game in pretty much every possible way over the years - I remember one of the reasons they moved away from the block windows was the perceived advantage it gave to the mega-entrants; one season ended up with Zoran occupying 6 or 7 of the top 10 prize money positions which, however good that is for the individual, does not look too good in print for the big finale

Someone will correct me if I'm wrong but I believe YTM moved away from the 3 player per team rule and the entries went down, The Sun did the same thing and their entries went up

Not sure that something as simple as a back-to-block change would dramatically increase entries, in fact I'm not really sure what the answer is - just hope that ytm continues to survive

Only palyed YTM this season and last but must say it is my favourite. I do play the sun but really only because the prize money is so much higher and not because the format is better.

I like to format as it is at the moment, but would like to see a max of 3 players from each limit to be introduced as I think this may even the playing field for the non multi's, although it has been shown that players can compete with only 5 teams.

I think if YTM took a chance and increased the prize money from 2-10 they would reap the benefits.

Totally against block transfer windows, for the same reasons as striker gave years ago; you can be stuck with an injured player, with no chance of using your skill to pick a replacement, maybe for months on end. Wouldn't be surprised, however, if clever tv suggest to the mirror to try their bundesliga game format - which they promote as having been a success - which has a block transfer window, but it's a squad game of 18 players.

Whatever, moving to block transfer windows would surely bring down the entries for the monthly comps (as players wouldn't have the chance to use tactics in lots of transfers over a four week period), and as mentioned elswhere, that's a big chunk of the ytm entry - relatively bigger than for other fantasy games.

No amount of tweaking the rules will increase figures, if they don't get the marketing right, and indeed the perception of the customer as to whether the game represents good value. With the cost of transfers plus entry, total price to the customer for one team is higher than playing the sun game - yet the sun top prize is more than seven times bigger than ytm. Unless that changes drastically, Joe public won't be attracted to ytm, irrespective of rule changes that interest more serious players.

Totally agree Quizking, entry fee is on the high side. Would like them to go down the telegraph route and offer a 3/4 teams for £10 including transfers.

Block Transfer Windows would be a backward move.........I'm completely against it

I feel transfer windows is only a minor factor in number of entries. The original problem of multi domination has not been solved but maybe has been limited. Compare the Sun where one entrant had 20,000 teams last season!

I reckon two factors have caused the sad decline in 2010/11.
1 The entry fee is far higher than comparable games so in a period of recession has had a disastrous effect.
2 England's feeble world cup perfomance before the season created a feel-bad factor which discourages the casual player. The Star and Sun were similarly affected but the Sun counteracted by raising prizes. Only they were in a strong enough position to do so. TFF resisted the decline by having a much improved website and generally developing the game well.

I'm against bringing back block Transfer Windows to the current game, they did lead to mass entries, which gave YTM its reputation as a game for the semi-pros but, moving forward, I think that it's more important for The Mirror to get their pricing, launch date and general marketing right if they want to reverse the big decline in entries.

IMHO, 30 transfers is too many - but it's more important to me that YTM retains its weekly transfer deadline, rather than slip further down the tactical slope towards TFF. I also disagree with re-introducing player-per-club limits as this restricts choice and increases the chances that teams will have the same players from the leading clubs.

Overall, let's hope that the game continues next season (nothing mentioned in the Final Season Update eMail - although they have awarded those who finished from 11-50 a free entry). However, if it does I would expect a much-reduced prize pool with 50k, or less, to the overall winner.

Reading that old thread, one sad thing of note is the dramatic decline in the quality of customer service provided by the YTM organisers - but at least the Web Site is a lot better now.

Not to mention finishing 1st in a monthly and being placed 2nd three days later

It's good to see all your views. My only argument is that there is various games out there, anytime transfers throughout the season, however YTM back then was the only one with block transfer windows, points was based on skill alone (no ratings or MOTM's) and was something to those that could just play the game and leave well alone for a few months.....then do their transfers. The majority of people will be working and can't manage to keep up with the transfers throughout the season, hence them dropping out. I'm looking at this just to raise numbers more than anything. If we were to all have our thoughts about a 'right' game or the 'best' game, then we'd not exactly name The Sun Dream Team as theirs is without a doubt a complete shambles and a joke with points being given so highly on ratings and so on, but we all play it and 'give it a go' but they get big numbers playing due to easability factor of the game (until they brought in the new 'wdt' ) and also the high prize money.

Remember there was high prize money as the numbers began to dwindle, so don't think it's so much to do with that. Something tells me that it was the easability of the game itself with the block transfer windows.

Will be interesting to see what will be done next year and really hope that the game is given high priority with their launch as they definitely miss out every season being the last to launch the game. If they could get themselves in order and launch the game first, I'm sure they would give themselves much higher numbers playing the game too.

I think the two main stumbling blocks to a high entry level in this game are Late launch and high entry cost.
Top prize per entry is still the best out there but paying for transfers is driving people away.
Remember, to a casual player (non fiso) £8 per side plus paying for transfers is just too expensive compared to a simple £5 in the sun for a chance (however small) of winning £500k)

I didn't play YTM this year mainly due to the increase in transfers meant more time would have to be spent on teams. Too similar to TFF which was less expensive. I'll look again next season but unless something changes I doubt i'll be back. Block transfers suit me but I can understand arguments for and against.

The logic of the higher numbers when there were transfer windows does seem to have credence and that has to register with their finance director or whatever they have.Then the scenario of the same few names on top of the leaderboard is the other side of the coin it seems.I don't expect them to change it back though anything's possible if the windows choice resonates with them though whatever option is presented just hope to get my gameplan correct.With the windows the only time I was leading this I started flailing after the 1st window still finishing top 50 so better than after the rule change.So need to brush up on my transfer usage if it's the same rules next season and I believe I can improve as have reaccessed my approach though whether it's enough is another question.It also seems the only one where transfers cost as The Sun removed that extra cost themselves recently and The Daily Star,TFF,etc have anytime transfers which don't entertain a fee whereas YTM's do even when they moved from windows to anytime where the only differential was the weekly lock in.It was quite interesting when the monthly was twice the prize it is presently then again The Sun used have a 20k one that's now 3k though obviously they have the overall numbers in prizes,customer base and mass appeal.Congrats to the winning duo btw.I guess if a stray motm award decided it that'd be the hot topic right now.

I'd like to see a variation on the block transfer system which rewards skill and effort, but also makes the game easier to play. I'd have 5 transfer windows with a total of 15 transfers. You could opt to use all your transfers in any window or none at all. If the windows are spread out properly it negates having to carry injured players for too long. It also gives the chance for a skilled player to work out a superior transfer strategy while not making it too much work for the casual player.

However, I doubt anything they do is going to increase entry numbers unless they address some of the basic marketing mistakes they have been making. Other posters before me have mentioned most of these. It's not exactly rocket science. The quote below from quizking sums up my views on this also.

If the organisers are looking for feedback, here are some suggestions:

- charge flat fee for each team entry, including transfers; the extra payment for team changes is repellent; it's like seeing a PC that's reasonably priced before it dawns on you that VAT has to be added on

- the Hall of Fame* shows multiple awards going to the same person; would guess that this is also offputting to the average manager; maybe restrict prizes to one per household each season, including monthlies?

- find a unique design niche - different to Sun and Telegraph - that might attract new contestants; advertise this appropriately

Realize readers may not agree with some of the above; but surely FF games, like all businesses, need to adapt (or else)...

* 2011 winners (congratulations to the FISOns listed): http://youthemanager.mirrorfootball.co. ... loffame.do

I have always played YTM (small scale mind) but missed the 24 hour window for half priced teams and refused to pay £8 on principle when I could get better value elsewhere. IMO opinion the pricing for there game is where they need to make the biggest change and I would think there would have been thousands of people who had a similar view to myself last season

Some interesting points posted above,have to agree 30 transfers is far too many..Like most I will wait and see what, if any, changes are made to YTM next season before deciding on entries....

I like the daily updates in YTM unlike the Sun 'waiting game' and agree with Daz about too many points based on the ratings. It wouldn't be an issue if the ratings were fairly accurate based on performances but week on week they disappoint, don't want to start that debate again.

The temptation with the Sun is obviously the prize money available but again will see what the 'larger entrant' does as I don't want a repeat of the fiasco last season which was terribly managed. Another debate i'm not going into.....

Enjoy the banter on the forums and happy to continue winning a few grand again next season..

In think there will be quite a few Fiso members that switch from SDT to ?.

If the Mirror can get this right, they could see an influx of numbers.