2018 FIFA World Cup qualifiers

[camelot70]

just 2 weeks to Big Sams international baptism. Who will he choose for his first selections on the trail to Russia in 2018 ? There should be plenty of FISO comment along the way. and possibly some team selections to guide him and his assistants in the task ahead. This weeks matches should offer some clues.

[camelot70]

we now know that Rooney will captain England but who will be in the starting xi in Slovakia on Sunday. Make a forecast by noon on Friday and it could be worth your while. Interesting to see how many of you actually read the posts ( and respond)

[Subsonic]

Hart

Walker
Stones
Cahill
Shaw

Drinkwater
Dier

Lallana
Rooney
Sterling

Vardy

[murf]

I thought I cared little during the Euro 2016 but, things have changed and so, now I care even less.

Sam, just rest the Liverpool players and don't break anyone in my fantasy teams. Cheers!

[camelot70]

just a few hours before the Slovakia match and Sam's baptism of what ? The thread has hardly set FISO alight and only Subsonic ventured a team selection. No Drinkwater in the starting eleven and no Vardy either ! Perhaps there will be a little FISO comment whatever the outcome.

[forestfan]

Eight of the Ice Wallies starting... disappointed not to see more scapegoats really, a large portion of the squad should have been sent back to their clubs and told they might get a recall if they get themselves on the Ballon d'Or shortlist, or something like that. I know the depth isn't really there in terms of replacing them, but Wales did OK with plenty of lower Premier League and Championship players, and we have another cakewalk qualifying group so it wouldn't really matter. Perhaps indicates the FA's marketing department/sponsors have a lot of influence, and they want players from Man Utd and Liverpool not Burnley and Bournemouth wearing the shirt.

Will be watching more out of curiosity than any real hope or excitement. I suspect Big Sam will get the team more organised and focused, but we're a long way from competing with the best whoever is in charge.

[Tacalabala]

It does make me laugh when people are surprised that a new England managers largely the same players as the previous man - where are these other 23 players meant to come from? And if they are better, wouldn't the previous guy picked them?

Roy was exposed as a poor tournament planner, but the players really let themselves down against Iceland, it seemed to me that not a single one of them on the park was prepared to let rip and force a performance out the team, Roy Keane like. We don't seem to have any players like that, and Sam is going to be up against it to find anyone like that.

[forestfan]

It does make me laugh when people are surprised that a new England managers largely the same players as the previous man - where are these other 23 players meant to come from? And if they are better, wouldn't the previous guy picked them

It's not so much "better" as "would care more about playing for England" and "not picked because of which clubs they play for".

Jordan Henderson for example wouldn't get near the England squad if he was still at Sunderland, likewise Lallana if at Southampton... not singling out Liverpool players specifically, but conversely players who leave bit part roles at the big six for starting places lower down tend to mysteriously disappear from contention. If Wilshere stays at Bournemouth long term he won't get another look in. If Barkley played for Arsenal he wouldn't have been the fall guy this time. Big Sam has said in the past he would pick Noble, but given the opportunity he didn't. Keepers are now a different issue, given we no longer have an English keeper playing at any of the Premier League's big six clubs!

[blahblah]

just a few hours before the Slovakia match and Sam's baptism of what ? The thread has hardly set FISO alight and only Subsonic ventured a team selection. No Drinkwater in the starting eleven and no Vardy either ! Perhaps there will be a little FISO comment whatever the outcome.

Why?

It should be a simple qualification followed by a disappointing Tournament. Admittedly the last few have been so bad that we don't really know what the Tournament expectations are

Obviously any struggling to qualify will be a national disgrace and calls for him to be hung, drawn and quartered, but he will probably just be sacked.

[forestfan]

just a few hours before the Slovakia match and Sam's baptism of what ? The thread has hardly set FISO alight and only Subsonic ventured a team selection. No Drinkwater in the starting eleven and no Vardy either ! Perhaps there will be a little FISO comment whatever the outcome.

Why?

It should be a simple qualification followed by a disappointing Tournament. Admittedly the last few have been so bad that we don't really know what the Tournament expectations are

Obviously any struggling to qualify will be a national disgrace and calls for him to be hung, drawn and quartered, but he will probably just be sacked.

Not qualifying might be the wake-up call we need, like the rugby team's home World Cup humiliation and the one-day cricket team's capitulation to Bangladesh, and of course that solitary gold medal in Atlanta...

[Tacalabala]

just a few hours before the Slovakia match and Sam's baptism of what ? The thread has hardly set FISO alight and only Subsonic ventured a team selection. No Drinkwater in the starting eleven and no Vardy either ! Perhaps there will be a little FISO comment whatever the outcome.

Why?

It should be a simple qualification followed by a disappointing Tournament. Admittedly the last few have been so bad that we don't really know what the Tournament expectations are

Obviously any struggling to qualify will be a national disgrace and calls for him to be hung, drawn and quartered, but he will probably just be sacked.

Not qualifying might be the wake-up call we need, like the rugby team's home World Cup humiliation and the one-day cricket team's capitulation to Bangladesh, and of course that solitary gold medal in Atlanta...

Literally no other country would say this - Germans don't care about qualification, they simply assume they will. And the 70s didn't really lead to success in the 80a either.

Players like Henderson are playing at big clubs like Liverpool because they are better than other players at smaller clubs. If he had a horrific season, Liverpool would drop him, simple as that. You have to allow also for the fact that Sam will have a preference for certain types of players to make up his squad - Drinkwater seems to be very BS like player.

It's not about caring so much as showing a level of professionalism. That night against Iceland was a bad reflection on the squad professionalism, and I would tell them that I could not accept that.

[forestfan]

Do we want the "best" players, or the ones that could potentially produce the most effective team though? Man for man, how many Welsh players would make the England team, or even squad, no more than a handful. But they play for each other and support their one big star, and are a lot more than the sum of their parts. England pick names, put square pegs in round holes, and are a lot less than the sum of their parts.

The sense of entitlement that these big club players have leads to this lack of professionalism, or whatever you call it. If they feel "we won't be dropped because of who we play for/because there's nobody else" they will continue to go through the motions in an England shirt.

[Tacalabala]

Coleman certainly picked the best players available to him, his pool of decent players is quite shallow to be honest. What Coleman has done is got that squad in the right place mentally and drilled a way of playing that gets the most out of what he has. Basically, great man management.

[forestfan]

Coleman certainly picked the best players available to him, his pool of decent players is quite shallow to be honest. What Coleman has done is got that squad in the right place mentally and drilled a way of playing that gets the most out of what he has. Basically, great man management.

Yes, but he doesn't have a bunch of players who believe their own hype due to being moderately important figures at big clubs. Is it possible for anyone to get more out of this generation of England players, or is whoever is in charge wasting their time trying to do so? Guess we will find out over the next few years, given nobody in charge is going to make radical selection decisions such as dropping players who have a shit tournament.

[Maldini]

We beat Wales didn't we? And although the scoreline suggested otherwise, we were the far superior team.

[Tacalabala]

Coleman certainly picked the best players available to him, his pool of decent players is quite shallow to be honest. What Coleman has done is got that squad in the right place mentally and drilled a way of playing that gets the most out of what he has. Basically, great man management.

Yes, but he doesn't have a bunch of players who believe their own hype due to being moderately important figures at big clubs. Is it possible for anyone to get more out of this generation of England players, or is whoever is in charge wasting their time trying to do so? Guess we will find out over the next few years, given nobody in charge is going to make radical selection decisions such as dropping players who have a shit tournament.

If you can name me a squad of 23, none of which appeared at Euro 2016, for this game against Slovakia, I'll be impressed. Also, imagine if Big Sam had gone down the experimental route and lost today? It'd be castigated for it, in many ways you can't win with selection.

[forestfan]

Coleman certainly picked the best players available to him, his pool of decent players is quite shallow to be honest. What Coleman has done is got that squad in the right place mentally and drilled a way of playing that gets the most out of what he has. Basically, great man management.

Yes, but he doesn't have a bunch of players who believe their own hype due to being moderately important figures at big clubs. Is it possible for anyone to get more out of this generation of England players, or is whoever is in charge wasting their time trying to do so? Guess we will find out over the next few years, given nobody in charge is going to make radical selection decisions such as dropping players who have a shit tournament.

If you can name me a squad of 23, none of which appeared at Euro 2016, for this game against Slovakia, I'll be impressed. Also, imagine if Big Sam had gone down the experimental route and lost today? It'd be castigated for it, in many ways you can't win with selection.

I'm not saying drop all 23, but perhaps something approaching double figures. If we have to go down the leagues, so be it... still, as you say, they're always going to take the cautious approach, to satisfy the media, sponsors and fans of big clubs.

[blahblah]

It appears that the words to the Slovak National Anthem are "Big Sam's Barmy Army"

[forestfan]

Well, that was barely deserved, even if Walcott's goal shouldn't have been disallowed a few minutes earlier.

Anyway, with three points from the only vaguely difficult game I guess that means we've qualified, so can go through the motions for a couple of years before the inevitable tournament letdown.

[Dennisthemenace]

This was a must win game for me. A must win game to get the new manager off to a start and a foundation to build some togetherness that we seem to have been lacking over the Hodgson era.

I think Allardyce knows we haven't got world beaters or indeed any on the horizon but what we can do is to be tough to beat and hope that builds confidence for when tournament finals comes around.

A good start on that journey. Lucky maybe? But nothing wrong with a bit of luck in football.

[buu1333]

Coleman certainly picked the best players available to him, his pool of decent players is quite shallow to be honest. What Coleman has done is got that squad in the right place mentally and drilled a way of playing that gets the most out of what he has. Basically, great man management.

Yes, but he doesn't have a bunch of players who believe their own hype due to being moderately important figures at big clubs. Is it possible for anyone to get more out of this generation of England players, or is whoever is in charge wasting their time trying to do so? Guess we will find out over the next few years, given nobody in charge is going to make radical selection decisions such as dropping players who have a shit tournament.

Coleman certainly picked the best players available to him, his pool of decent players is quite shallow to be honest. What Coleman has done is got that squad in the right place mentally and drilled a way of playing that gets the most out of what he has. Basically, great man management.

I agree with these comments, in some way. In the final third it is like they are looking for that perfect pass or try too beat players, ( believe their own hype) which makes it to slow and easier to defend against. i loved Walcott quick one touch then quick dangerous cross in the box near the end of the match . Usually he has to prove he fast , beat a player or two and then find the perfect pass in the box .

i think that what made wales so good at euros. quick fast direct passing, no messing around

[Edmondson]

Thought we clearly deserved the win v Slovakia, the Walcott goal was correctly disallowed for the touch Sturridge had when the defender made the tackle - not convinced the officials saw this, so got it right by accident maybe.

All this talk of Wales, they're hardly any kind of yardstick, as has been pointed out, we beat them in a dire game, they had one decent win v disorganised Belgiums, massively over hyped but fair play to them for taking the opportunities afforded them.

The plus points from today:

Stones - good to see him in at centre back, makes a massive difference having someone who can pass it in a position where you see a lot of possession. Good to see him take the bull by the horns and get forward.

Hart - looked a little subdued and iffy, this is a good thing, he needed taking down and will be better for it, the injuries to his main rivals affording him the time to turn it around.

The full backs - would like to have seen Shaw, but can't really fault Rose and Walker looks ideal for this sort of group, where you need someone to link with the right winger.

Lallana - fast becoming England's best player, interesting to see how he goes for Liverpool this season, should thrive under Klopp in that side.

Alli - nice cameo, full of enterprise, bit of fight, good to see when may have felt hard done by losing his starting spot.

Dier - good solid pick, brings the balance, nice to see he has cemented his spot.

Not worth bothering with the obvious weaknesses, going over old ground.

[camelot70]

as the starter of the thread it was very gratifying to get a good quick response from FISO just prior to the game. forest fan excelled himself with 6 comments. The variety was good too with the bonus of an Edmundson post game review. Now if I was getting any sort of response for GOALS GALORE (starting next week) from FISO followers that would be even better.

[buu1333]

Thought we clearly deserved the win v Slovakia, the Walcott goal was correctly disallowed for the touch Sturridge had when the defender made the tackle - not convinced the officials saw this, so got it right by accident maybe.

All this talk of Wales, they're hardly any kind of yardstick, as has been pointed out, we beat them in a dire game, they had one decent win v disorganised Belgiums, massively over hyped but fair play to them for taking the opportunities afforded them.

The plus points from today:

Stones - good to see him in at centre back, makes a massive difference having someone who can pass it in a position where you see a lot of possession. Good to see him take the bull by the horns and get forward.

Hart - looked a little subdued and iffy, this is a good thing, he needed taking down and will be better for it, the injuries to his main rivals affording him the time to turn it around.

The full backs - would like to have seen Shaw, but can't really fault Rose and Walker looks ideal for this sort of group, where you need someone to link with the right winger.

Lallana - fast becoming England's best player, interesting to see how he goes for Liverpool this season, should thrive under Klopp in that side.

Alli - nice cameo, full of enterprise, bit of fight, good to see when may have felt hard done by losing his starting spot.

Dier - good solid pick, brings the balance, nice to see he has cemented his spot.

Not worth bothering with the obvious weaknesses, going over old ground.

Yes but wales don't find it hard to score it the other games at the euros like we do. We completely isolate our forward all the time because we take too long to pass it because our players are looking for the perfect pass in the final third. bales and Ramsey just whip it in. Again walcot one touch , one dangerous cross which daniel Sturridge nearly got on the end of amazed me because Walcott actually had space to dribble and run foward, if he did it would of been too late and Sturridge or whoever else was up front would of been isolated

[buu1333]

and wales topped the group something we always struggle to do

[Edmondson]

So Big Sam isn't big enough it seems, Rooney can choose to play where he wants and knows more about international football than his manager (which may well be true) and because of this Big Sam doesn't feel he can tell him what to do.

Isn't he effectively tendering his resignation If he can't tell the players what to do, then isn't that a fundamental break down in his job role?

Clever man management playing to Rooney's ego....not really, as if anything lumps the pressure back on Rooney who was struggling as it was to communicate his view that too much is being made of his role in the side. What would other players think in the side?

Hopefully these ludicrous comments from Big Sam will spark some decent feedback from those close to him, maybe he will see sense and see the only way out of this is to end the Rooney sideshow.

[blahblah]

Yep, ridiculous.....

[forestfan]

Anyway, away from England matters... European champions Portugal started with a 2-0 defeat in Switzerland, and runners-up France fared little better in a goalless draw with Belarus.

Only one to quality automatically from each group, remember, and one runner-up won't even get a play-off... with Spain and Italy in the same group as well, could be some big names under pressure to make it to Russia.

[forestfan]

OK, so... England are there, that's about as much as it's worth saying. Except that we do actually have a world-class striker, if we can somehow get the ball to him.

Wales and Scotland have done their chances the world of good this week, surely at least one of them and the two Irish sides will make it through the play-offs? Could be the best British Isles representation since 1986 at least.

Meanwhile it's getting increasingly Messi for Argentina. Lose in Ecuador and they're out. Draw and they're reliant on other results and perhaps what should be a gimme play-off with New Zealand... the likes of Italy and Holland could yet be watching on TV next summer as well!

[Edmondson]

England could just about scrape a passable XI together if everyone was fit this summer.

How likely is that? Would Southgate make the right picks? Not sure. Also needs loads of work of getting the right shape to the side, not sure he's the man for this either.

Would like to see:


-----------------Butland---------------
Walker----Stones----Cahill-----Rose
-------------------Dier------------------
---------Henderson---Lallana---------
-------------------Alli-------------------
------------Kane-------Rashford--------


Keeper: Hart needs kicking out the squad, very strange bloke, awful keeper that thinks he's great, you don't want that sort of thing in your squad.

Full Backs: Have to be our width, can't trust any of those jokers like Sterling playing out there. Sit Dier in front of centre backs as he often does for Spurs.

Centre Back: Need an in form Stones. Alongside would be good to see someone come through like Maguire or Dunk, but have stuck with Cahill for now.

Central Midfield: With Dier holding, Henderson can provide the legs, Lallana the craft. Play Delli at the top of the diamond.

Strikers: Kane is obviously our best player and Rashford provides the pace and X factor, let him loose down the middle but can drift out when full backs haven't bombed on.

Really struggling beyond these players, especially in midfield and up front.