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Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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Ashers
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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Ashers »

Striker wrote:Very interesting weekend for those more interested in either of the two fantasy horse racing comps than in fantasy football, with real potential for some fascinating racing and possibly leader board shake ups.
Shame Sam Twiston Davies gave Big Bucks the worse possible ride. If there was one way the horse was going to lose, it was the way he lost today.

However, Annie Power wins again and is now only 8 wins behind Big Bucks' record.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by stevejtr »

Yes, for a horse that has been off so long he made far too much use of him IMO. However, Nicholls' comments after suggest he's far from concerned and needed the horse to be in a race rather than preserving the record.


I was left with the impression the purpose of today was to race the horse to get it fit rather than to win.

However BB was superb in defeat and though I do feel he won't win in March he lost little in losing today bar an unbeaten streak.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Striker »

Ashers wrote:Shame Sam Twiston Davies gave Big Bucks the worse possible ride. If there was one way the horse was going to lose, it was the way he lost today.
As someone who hasn't sat on a horse since my teens, I'm always reluctant to criticise a jockey, but I agree that my immediate reaction was that STD hadn't exactly covered himself in glory. However Nicholls said that he had instructed him to ride him positively and "if he got tired, he got tired". So I agree with Steve that today was not a high priority.

As regards The Jumps I was pleased that Red Sherlock won well enough to suggest that he has a genuine chance in the Neptune, as he is one of my few horses who isn't super popular in other lists.

As regards TTTF, despite At Fishers Cross improving dramatically on this season's form, it was disappointing that he didn't win as he'd have significantly improved my current 92nd position. By contrast Hurricane Fly winning tomorrow will be almost irrelevant TTTF-wise as he seems to be in over 90% of decent line ups.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by stevejtr »

Jumping cost AFC the race again. Far too sloppy and if he is to win at the highest level that must improve.

Seemed to be better as the pace was increased but he hasn't the speed for 2m and at 3m he won't get the pace it seems. Disappointing.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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Mt TTTF has totally been blwon out of the water.

Have dropped from 20th to outside the top 200 due to not having Annie Power or Sire De Grugy.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Ashers »

I have a feeling Jezki will win tomorrow, but would like to see Our Conor run a good race.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by stevejtr »

The Fly pisses it for me. Despite the midweek setback

But defeat is possible and that might make WM run Un de Sceaux which would be a massive benefit to TNO

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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For me Un de Sceaux is going to win the Champion Hurdle.

I can't see past him.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Striker »

Even though the Fly and Un de Sceaux are key elements of my fantasy entries, and I'm generally successful punting on the horses, I can never develop the certainties that you guys seem to possess;-

The Fly PISSES it, or Un de Sceaux IS going to win the Champion Hurdle, are anathema to me. Perhaps the different levels of certainty we allow ourselves is a personality thing.

While like most people, I expect the Fly to win tomorrow, neither Jezki or Our Conor can be ruled out, while I still regard the Champion Hurdle as a 4/5 horse race, and we still don't know how far Annie Power's potential can take her. Of course this uncertainty of mine doesn't stop me dabbling in the ante post Market when the prices represent value.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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stevejtr wrote:Jumping cost AFC the race again. Far too sloppy and if he is to win at the highest level that must improve.

Seemed to be better as the pace was increased but he hasn't the speed for 2m and at 3m he won't get the pace it seems. Disappointing.
Agree with the first para, although I'd take away the "far", but I thought that given his recent efforts today suggested that his physical problems seem to have been largely sorted out, and that it was a highly encouraging display. If his jumping improves marginally and the stable gets back to form, he has a real chance in the World. As you say he doesn't have the speed for high class races over 2m, but I wouldn't rule him out over 3m in March.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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Striker wrote:Even though the Fly and Un de Sceaux are key elements of my fantasy entries, and I'm generally successful punting on the horses, I can never develop the certainties that you guys seem to possess;-
Was talking about the Irish Champion today: Up against 3 opponents all of whom he's beaten before.The jump from novice grade to the top table is a harsh climb in 2m hurdles and whilst Jezki and Our Conor are very good, to my mind they still have to improve 7 or 8lb to bridge the gap.

Agree the race in March is far more open and that's a different kettle of fish completely,

UDS could be anything but has dispatched average horses with consummate ease.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Striker »

stevejtr wrote:1. Was talking about the Irish Champion today.

2. Up against 3 opponents all of whom he's beaten before.The jump from novice grade to the top table is a harsh climb in 2m hurdles and whilst Jezki and Our Conor are very good, to my mind they still have to improve 7 or 8lb to bridge the gap.
1. I realised that.

2. Excellently expressed in a nutshell. But I don't think that that means he will PISS it. However this is not the first time that I've split hairs on fiso commenting on hyperbole. :oops:

Its certainly an interesting race as there is a possibility that the Fly could "piss it" but there are several real questions. How much will Our Conor improve for his first run when most reports suggest that the trainer had left a lot to work on for the future, and that he was to some extent under-prepared.

Although there's probably less room for improvement in Jezki's condition, there could be limited scope for this and he did lose a length or so when boxed in last time.

Personally I have no idea who of the two main challengers will finish in front of other. However if one of them was to spring a surprise, I'd hope that it would be Our Conor, as while he might not be as good as Jezki, he is IMO more likely to be better than both the others than Jezki is, if you get the logic. However like you and most observers I certainly wouldn't back against the favourite, and expect him to win.

It would be great if today's race adds to the uncertainty surrounding the Champion Hurdle rather than making one of them Ireland's outstanding prospect. A Brave Inca/Hardy Eustace/Harchibald type situation with a young(ish) English horse and an Irish mare thrown into the equation would be a tantalising prospect for March.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Ashers »

Noticed I missed a key element on UDS - Meant to say 'in the future'. :oops:

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by stevejtr »

Annie Power is an interesting horse. Won't take on Quevega so CH or World? Latter for me but we'll see what WM does.

I would expect Our Conor to improve, but then I suspect the Fly will be closer to match fitness too.

This is probably the Fly's last CH so perhaps UDS for 2015. Needs to step up in grade before any real judgement can be taken IMO.

But all this is what makes racing so fascinating...

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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Striker wrote:However this is not the first time that I've split hairs on fiso commenting on hyperbole. :oops:
No worries. I may have partaken of some nice red before writing this... :oops:

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Ashers »

Trifolium just destroyed Felix Younger and Defy Logic.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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Ashers wrote:Trifolium just destroyed Felix Younger and Defy Logic.
Hoping that come Cheltenham, Champagne Fever makes today's race appear irrelevant. :wink:

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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stevejtr wrote:But all this is what makes racing so fascinating...
Exactly. It's just a pity that there is so little interest on fiso compared to that in football, when the web is so much more tangled and therefore more interesting.

Inter alia, Harry Redknapp is a mere amateur compared to Barney! :wink:

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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Totally agree, are either of you members of any racing forums?

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Ashers »

Hurricane Fly wins again, but Our Conor took another step forward.

Hurricane Fly showed that he can battle and can fight if needed.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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Ashers wrote:Totally agree, are either of you members of any racing forums?
Unfortunately not, as I haven't discovered a good one. Some years ago, I read, but didn't contribute to, the Betfair forum, but soon gave up as the average post was rarely worth reading, its "prize plonker" element put fiso to shame in the "idiot stakes".

So my interest is largely confined to reading and TV. At least Mrs Striker who can be pretty determined at times to control the TV remote, understands that racing is sacrosanct on our main TV. There are several journalists who are well worth reading and I particularly enjoy reading Tom Segal, even ignoring his tips which deserve their reputation, the guy is so reasonable and balanced.

Although many people follow racing its a limited number compared to football if my experience is anything to go by. Although I'd guess that 60% of my male friends and acquaintances are happy to suddenly switch the conversation to the Premiership, very few want to talk about racing, their interest ranging from luke warm to zero!

The level of most people's interest is that to enjoy going to the races, they must have a bet on most races. Last Christmas when I went to Kempton with Miss Striker who had a small bet on every race, she was perplexed knowing that I bet sometimes and had studied the form on the train, that I did not have a single bet at the course. I enjoyed the day even though it didn't directly lead to pigeon-holing any future bets.

I was fascinated by racing as a kid and from the age of around 8 was known as a tipster in M&S head office where my father worked, with beneficiaries of successful "advice" slipping me the odd 5 shillings which was massive compared to my puny pocket money. My father was happy to take me to football, rarely wanted to go racing, unless it was my selected "birthday trip", and so from the age of 12-13 would hitch to race meetings and point to points either by myself or with a couple of friends. (Parents weren't so paranoid in those days, although earlier at the age of 9 I'd been grounded for a time after a secret day trip up to London on the tube with two friends, who were also subsequently grounded when we successfully filled up our "I Spy London" books). During one University vacation, I worked at Timeform, and on leaving Uni had a racing journalist offer. I put it on hold while I popped off to Africa for a year, but as I stayed there and in other parts of the developing world for 40 years, that "career" never went very far. :wink: So its now time to re-engage in the interest of my youth.

Blimey that was a post that finished up very differently from the intention when I initially responded. :oops: But at least it shows that I am genuinely interested in racing. :wink:

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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Ashers wrote:Totally agree, are either of you members of any racing forums?
No. Not found one tbh.

Was brought up with racing & have retained my love of the sport.


Just watched the race on ATR site (MrsJtr wanted a new pair of trail shoes so didn't see it live :shock: :cry: )

Thought The Fly was beaten with the so-so jump at the last but won going away in the end. Whether that was down to Our Conor still needing sharpness or just having run its race I'm not sure. I suspect WM will be delighted to have retained the streak but will be wary of the young pretender come March.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Striker »

Good race in itself, and adds to the fascination of the Champion itself.

At the last I wouldn't have been comfortable if I had a large stake on Hurricane Fly. But only 10 seconds or so of real discomfort. :wink:

One now has to suspect that McCoy will be on MTOY.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by stevejtr »

4 in a line round the home turn and Jezki fails to finish in front of the 13 year old.

Yup. MTOY definitely

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Ashers »

Think the CH will be the race of the festival.

You have the four main contenders in HF, MTOY, AP and TNO.

But then throw in Jezki, UDS, ROR and GRANDOUET and you have a fantastic race.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

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Have you tried OLBG.com?

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by topspur »

Sorry to break in on this triumvirate but only just stumbled across you hidden away. I've found the Racing Forum useful from time to time but you do get some playground fights on there.

For the past three years (7 comps) I've taken part in a TTFF mini league every six months - flat and jumps - its been going for more than 10 years and very well run. About 200 do the jumps and 140 the flat - Top half pay nothing bottom half play a £100 - so decent prize money for the top half dozen. 2 subs allowed at halfway at £5 a time.
I can send you details if you're interested. Picked up a few hundred a couple of times and only paid once - looking a bit iffy this year though.

Will you guys be at Cheltenham ? - I make the trip down every year.

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Ashers »

topspur wrote:Sorry to break in on this triumvirate but only just stumbled across you hidden away. I've found the Racing Forum useful from time to time but you do get some playground fights on there.

For the past three years (7 comps) I've taken part in a TTFF mini league every six months - flat and jumps - its been going for more than 10 years and very well run. About 200 do the jumps and 140 the flat - Top half pay nothing bottom half play a £100 - so decent prize money for the top half dozen. 2 subs allowed at halfway at £5 a time.
I can send you details if you're interested. Picked up a few hundred a couple of times and only paid once - looking a bit iffy this year though.

Will you guys be at Cheltenham ? - I make the trip down every year.
I am interested, I will be at Cheltenham all fours days for the 10th year running.

Fancy a pint there?

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by topspur »

Sure - As long as you promise not to wear that shirt ! :wink:

I'll be down tues to thurs - always come home for the GC. Have sent you a PM which gives you a flavour of the weekly email that the organiser (Bob) sends out. Its same scoring as the old TTFF competition. Interesting names on the email cc who take part include Mike Cattermole, Zoey Bird, a big contingent from Betfair, some RP journos as well I think. The flat in 2012 was won by the owner of Dancing Rain (he was the only to pick it !)

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Re: Fantasy Racing 2013-14 * The Jumps *

Post by Ashers »

topspur wrote:Sure - As long as you promise not to wear that shirt ! :wink:

I'll be down tues to thurs - always come home for the GC. Have sent you a PM which gives you a flavour of the weekly email that the organiser (Bob) sends out. Its same scoring as the old TTFF competition. Interesting names on the email cc who take part include Mike Cattermole, Zoey Bird, a big contingent from Betfair, some RP journos as well I think. The flat in 2012 was won by the owner of Dancing Rain (he was the only to pick it !)
Look forward to joining, will you remind me nearer the time?

Which part of the course will you be in?

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