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Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

A Fantasy Football forum for news on the fantasy football game promoted by The Mirror and Racing Post newspapers which used to be called: You The Manager (YTM)
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Methane on Titan
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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Methane on Titan »

Striker wrote:MoT - Did you have your sense of humour by-pass op before or after you changed your user name?
That's a great come on :) Tempted to purchase some flowers :lol:

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by foreverengland »

Just to chip in, I think the whole set-up this year is innovative, but a little unclear.

The way I read it, Mirror have teamed up with BetWay on an affiliate basis - http://www.gpwa.org/affiliate-program/b ... rtner-7370" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

'Betway Partner, one of Europe’s most visible online gaming brands, offers a starting 35% lifetime commissions across their sportsbook, poker, casino, and games. Affiliates profit further from a high conversion rate, no negative carryover, personal affiliate support, a continuously updated banner bank, and easy-to-read reports on player activity and marketing-campaign effectiveness. Betway.com is available in 14 languages and they have Affiliate managers in 10 different languages such as Norwegian, Danish, Swedish, English, Polish, Italian, Spanish, French, Germany and Portuguese.'

I presume that for every tenner spent, the Mirror may be pocketing £3.50 thus offsetting some of their costs. Therefore I would guess that those that have joined without clicking on the Mirror affiliate link will be screwed, whilst the Mirror are banking on profiting from FF players long after the season has ended. I would also assume that the prize fund will be being paid for by the Mirror and should all be guaranteed.

I may be wrong, but this is how I read it anyhow. 8-)

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Dixon »

Stupid question time sorry. Do you need the betting account to enter the 1 free team?

Striker
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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Striker »

No

Just in case others need a summary of some of the key features.

1. You can enter one free team without a Betway account.
2. If you open a new Betway account via the Mirror fantasy site, you can enter 4 additional teams for every £10 bet.
3. If you are an existing Betway account holder, you can't get any additional teams. Similarly if you open a Betway account not via the Mirror site, you can't enter any additional teams. There is no way round this if you fall into one of these categories as you can't have more than one Betway account.
4. Betway appears to be a slightly dodgy bookie. They are rated AVOID by SBG.
5. You can only withdraw the welcome bonus once you have turned it over 15 times, and there are possible ambiguities attached to this.

This is clearly an unsatisfactory situation especially as the Mirror game appears to be a very well structured game. My guess is the the Mirror do not fully understand what they are doing re Betway. Lets hope that sensible changes are made and that the game and its prize fund survive.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Dixon »

Thank you Davidoff.

I only asked as a collegue tried entering and had a red message, something to do with a communication error, all his details had been entered correctly.
I haven't tried yet though.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Striker »

That's not a universal problem. I've entered my one and only team without any problems. Without the Betway "issues" it seems a great game.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Striker »

My above post (3.39 pm) may not be accurate as the small print suggests that anyone entering the game is opening a game account, and that anyone opening a game account is automatically opening a betting account with Betway, albeit without a debit card attached to the account. If this is correct anyone who has entered the game, even with just the one team may have inadvertently have opened a betting account. It just seems to get better and better.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by oldbigead »

What do we think happens if a player from the Premier League moves to a team in one of the five European Leagues? Say Modric went to Madrid would he still score points in this game?

Lets say you had Ronaldo and Modric would they both score points?

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Striker »

Striker wrote:
7lb claimer wrote:2.1 All welcome bonuses must be wagered 15 times in sportsbook before any funds can be withdrawn. (And to count the bets must be evens or above ) Not the way Paddy Power used to do it :cry:
So after several bets and the punter is well in profit, is the next bet using his welcome bonus for the nth time, or is he using his own funds?

The whole thing is very unsatisfactory. Although one can of course argue that since one is only betting peanuts, it doesn't matter.

I simply don't like dealing with people who construct such nonsense even if I'm making money from them. So I'll have my free team from the Mirror, and bet with straightforward bookies such as PP.

In fact I'd rather simply pay an entry fee of £10/team than have a Betway account. Life is too short to spend seeking very small bargains.
andye is now endorsing this on a new thread. Add to this the assessment of SBR who give Betway an AVOID rating and I think we know where we are.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by the-postman »

ytm was such a great game to play whether winning or not up until last years fiasco :roll:

should be noted the guys who ran ytm until this mess are now in charge of the stars game 8-)

and whats in malta apart from some nice weather -a few soldiers and tony drago :shock:

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mad dog
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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by mad dog »

the-postman wrote:ytm was such a great game to play whether winning or not up until last years fiasco :roll:

should be noted the guys who ran ytm until this mess are now in charge of the stars game 8-)

and whats in malta apart from some nice weather -a few soldiers and tony drago :shock:

Take it the star game isn't out yet?

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Mirror HQ »

Firstly, thank you for the positive comments regarding this year’s game.

A lot of praise must go toward MIC (a subsidiary of GFM), we think they have created a slick, easy to use interface with a well structured player list.
We’re looking forward to seeing whether it will be better to choose one uber Spanish striker or whether you will get more bang for your buck choosing an RVP/Gomez or Rooney/DiNatale type combination.

We would not normally post in your forum, as we believe it is for fans not operators/publishers, but in light of a couple of posts, we thought we should clarify a number of things.

Trinity Mirror are liable for the prize fund and will pay it out directly to entrants by cheque.

Betway are fully licensed by the LGA of Malta. Historically they have primarily operated in Scandinavia and Germany, but are now looking to gain a footprint in the UK, hence the deal to integrate with Mirror Fantasy Football. Promo abuse and minimum wagering requirements are standard across most gaming companies - however 15 times on a sports book could be seen as draconian, moving forward we will be removing this from Mirror Fantasy Football.

Issues with existing or multiple Betway accounts:
Existing Betway account holders and players who opened an account with Betway and then tried to register with the Trinity Mirror Game ARE allowed to enter the competition and will benefit from the offer of 4 free teams for every £10 bet. All sportsbook bets placed after the 12th of July will qualify for this offer.
The terms and conditions will be updated shortly to clarify this point.

Players who have opened an account directly with Betway can claim their free teams by following these instructions:

1. Sign up to Mirror.co.uk/fantasyfootball using the free team that we offer to all players, making a note of your registered email address and username.

2. Contact Betway through the MFF Contact us service (https://fantasyfootball.mirror.co.uk/contact-us" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;), stating both your Betway and MFF usernames and details of the bet(s) you staked after July 12th 2012.

3. In the contact us form, select the “Betway Free Team Allocation” choice from the drop down menu (available from midday 18th July 2012) and explain that you are a Betway customer who wants to associate an existing betting account with your Mirror Fantasy Football account.

4. We will credit your MFF account with the appropriate number of free teams earned on all bets from the 12th July 2012. All credits will be completed within 48 hours of your submission.

5. Go back to Mirror.co.uk/fantasyfootball and log in with your Mirror Fantasy Football account details. Once credited to your account, you can use all the free team credits that you have been awarded.

6. To earn more MFF team credits, you must use your Mirror Fantasy Football account. Bets placed directly through your Betway account will not generate any further free team credits.

We are looking forward to a great season ahead and wish you all good luck and good fortune with Mirror Fantasy Football and Betway.

John The Mirror Fantasy Manager

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Methane on Titan
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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Methane on Titan »

Thanks for that John. :)

Forget Striker he knows a lot about bookies and bonuses :wink:


He's in deep we might think :wink:


Check his name and history then simply bar him from playing, he's obviously trying to ruin the new game. :mrgreen:

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Striker »

What a contrast between the last two posts. Well done to the Mirror for sorting out the significant problems that existed due to Betway's terms and conditions, and their implications, which were totally inappropriate for any fantasy football game. It seems that although originally the Mirror did not fully appreciate the significance of the Betway T&C, once a few FF managers brought the various problems to their attention, they acted quickly and efficiently to resolve them. That's all we FF managers can ask of any game promoter or organiser.

Furthermore several of us who were initially concerned about the T&C always appreciated that the game itself appeared excellent, inter alia with a better tighter budget than some games. So let's hope that it will be a great success, if customer service maintains its excellent start.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Vid »

Thanks to John at the Mirror for sorting things out so quickly, something that should appease most FF players.

There does seem to be some bad press regarding Betway, of course for the FF player with little interest in the betting side its simply 4 teams for a tenner and a free bet that may or may not produce something down the line. For the more gambling savvy there appear to be a few problems, but possibly none with personal experience of them, yet.

No doubt should anything untoward happen to winning betting accounts in the next few weeks or months there will be a furore, best we deal with that if/ when it happens? Best practice is to do the minimum required (whatever that may be now) and withdraw funds at the earliest opportunity for the wary winner?

Regarding some of the personal discussions that have taken place in this thread, I wish to point you all towards our T&Cs that you agreed to when signing up to FISO.

forum-t-cs-t1545.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
fiso-forum-etiquette-read-before-posting-t1547.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Personal Disputes

The forums are not to be used for personal disputes, heated debates, personal attacks or aggresive/abusive name-calling against other members, flame wars etc. You are expected to treat each other with respect in the forums and take any personal disputes to a private mode of discussion off the forums. If you should find that your discussion is becoming too heated or someone is becoming far too passionate about their argument, please take the discussion to private message or email. The forum software also provides a foes option if you wish to hide all posts from selected members (you can still click to display a foe'd post).


and also the moderation of the forums thread
moderation-of-the-forums-t69354.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Some posts have crossed the line and been removed, at least one warning has been issued as a result. Please abide by the FISO's T&Cs and Etiquette guide at all times, we do not wish to issue warnings and bans but if anyone is constantly causing disruptions then we will.

Please do not reply to this part of my post in this thread, if you wish any discussion then please pm me.

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channel442
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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by channel442 »

You cannot play the game without opening an account with Betway. There is something very wrong about that and I think most people realize that.

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Vid
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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Vid »

channel442 wrote:You cannot play the game without opening an account with Betway. There is something very wrong about that and I think most people realize that.
The free team doesn't need an account does it?

Last season to play YTM it was necessary to open a "sQuid" account, I chose not to play. This season I probably will, mainly due to the size of the monthly prize, if I win 5.5k that the Mirror will pay out I'm not going to be bothered about £10 or £20 in a(nother) betting account.

The choice is for each individual to make, if you don't like it then don't sign up, there are plenty of other FF games on the market and plenty of other bookies too.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by quizking »

Vid wrote:
channel442 wrote:You cannot play the game without opening an account with Betway. There is something very wrong about that and I think most people realize that.
The free team doesn't need an account does it?

Last season to play YTM it was necessary to open a "sQuid" account, I chose not to play. This season I probably will, mainly due to the size of the monthly prize, if I win 5.5k that the Mirror will pay out I'm not going to be bothered about £10 or £20 in a(nother) betting account.

The choice is for each individual to make, if you don't like it then don't sign up, there are plenty of other FF games on the market and plenty of other bookies too.
Yes, the free team does entail setting up an account, even if you don't provide your card details - i phoned to check a couple of days ago, you are "assigned" a betway account and your name and address details are passed on to betway, supposedly to save time if you should decide to bet with them at a later date. I'm not happy about this either - will probably join but haven't 100% decided yet, am waiting to see what changes are made to t and c's etc.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Vid »

Haven't read the T&Cs and privacy policy but it would seem that even the free teams are open for marketing (ab)use then?

Can handle spam emails (a simple filter means you never have to see any after the first) but do you have to give a phone number? And if so can you get away with giving it incorrectly and not affect FF winnings?

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by dead parrot »

Vid wrote: Best practice is to do the minimum required (whatever that may be now) and withdraw funds at the earliest opportunity for the wary winner?
That is part of the problem. There are (to quote and apply the mirror post above) 'draconian' restrictions on withdrawing funds as detailed in the betway T&C

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by oldbigead »

The biggest problem to me seems that most a lot of bookies (especially those fitting Betways profile) will close a betting account down very quickly (even if you've not won much) if they think that you have any clue at all.

If this happens you won't be able to play the fantasy game.

This is obviously completely unacceptable. And a very real concern/problem.

This needs clarifying from the Mirror now not when it happens. By then it will be too late.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by 7lb claimer »

They bet 11/4 Chris Hoy and 7/1 Jason Kenny for the Olympic cycling sprint. Can you afford to have a bet? Not really as you will probably be outed as too clever as Oldbighead suggests :roll: I'm sticking to Open Golf threeballs in the hope that fifteen bets down the road I'm just behind :lol:

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by dweeboman »

Well i have done it and registered, all seems ok so far. will keep betting till the cash is gone and use the teams to have fun.
seems to me pay £25 , bet the lot away, slowly at first with small bets to get a tenner on the slip. when there is only 12 quid or less, bet on a single at good odds, if it comes in GREAT, if not . WRITE THE LOT OFF AS £25 FOR ALL YOUR TEAMS !!!!!!!
i think last year i paid about that for 12 teams. and had to do that SQUID rubish too
cheers steve :)

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by AkNotSpur »

Having been ripped off by Squid last season (the 3 teams that I paid for were never activated and I was left with just the free 'prize' team for my 10/11 finish) - there is no chance that I will now pay any money to an offshore bookmaker in order to play fantasy football. Furthermore, I will not enter a 'free' team if that entails my details being passed to an offshore bookmaker.

Looking at the game itself, I'm not sure that competing with a single team for just 2 individual season prizes would warrant the effort of making substitutions on most game days (and with the FA Cup - not to mention various European Leagues - in scope, there will be a lot of these). If I'm going to play this 15 man style of game, then FPL suits me better - as it's restricted to the Premier League and weekly subs. It's also disappointing that the old YTM scoring system has been replaced by one in which goals scored by both midfielders and strikers earn the same number of points.

To these eyes, the game now looks far better suited to the monthly specialist and I am sure that there will be some nail-biting finishes to that one - particularly when it comes to FA Cup time and both extra time and penalties count. Definitely one for the gambler, rather than the FF strategist.

Let's just hope that The Star continues to carry the YTM torch in the coming season.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by t.gridley »

Last year YTM was my favourite game. Sadly I will not be be participating this year.
The whole idea of joining an offshore bookie just to play FF is riduculous.
What with the Telegraph dropping its prize money by 20k and other no shows, it would appear that FF has morphed into a dying swan :(

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by mephisto »

It's not dying Terry, maybe just snagged downstream in a discarded shopping trolley. The Sun has increased to £125,000, Sky still around, so to The Mail. It's true all have a feel of "traffic" and "hits", largely to branded bookies and there is too an atmosphere of Logoc everywhere.."thou shall not place the wrong water bottle in thine children's lunchbox".
Can beggars be choosers? Some games are free or low cost, most dumbed-down pricewise, appealing to Mr and Mrs Mass Market.
But put it all in context...a win is still reasonably chunky and most on here would be content with that or a monthly.
However I do think the market is now ripe for a real player who sees the downturn as an opportunity...I am extremely surprised that the supermarkets are not yet involved in some capacity or any other big player that could sell packages at source (along the lottery route).
Anyways, its what we've got, like it or lump it. Real shame what's happened to the Mirror though.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by Methane on Titan »

Too much negative feedback over an attractive game. I would like to point out that the majority of criticism is coming from seasoned players and gamblers who have their own initiatives.

Let the public decide for themselves.

The game organisers need not be concerned by a handful of gamblers with experience of most/all betting sites.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by The Elkmaster »

Methane on Titan wrote:Too much negative feedback over an attractive game.
How can you label it attractive, when you are forced to open a betting account with a bookmaker unless you just want one team? With The Mirror going down this route, it's very unattractive.

It aint having any of my money, and I've played The Mirror game for a fair few years.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by t.gridley »

Entered my free team as a lucky dip but have decided not to play this game.
I am not interested in joining a offshore foreign bookie plus the fact that it is very high maintenance and the Messi/Ronaldo pick, no not for me.

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Re: Mirror Fantasy Football 2012/13

Post by quizking »

Decided to join and eventually got my teams in, but it took an hour and a half of going back and forth to the mirror and betway helpdesks, each one blaming the other for the credits from bets not registering on the game website. Fantasy football is supposed to be fun, registering for this wasn't.

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