return of British Fantasy Football

Post by **Knotty** » 13 Jul 2006, 00:07

thelip wrote:Give knotty his prize from the season before last and I'll reconsider.

12345678 wrote:as the lip says if knotty gets paid i'd think about changing my mind.

andy

Thanks all for the continued support!

Seems to me (trying not to be biased here) that this is exactly the same game operators who have simply dropped the Herald name from the game title (Gamemaster name rings a bell). Until proven otherwise, won't be touching this with a bargepole and seems I'm not the only one.

As Rich says, given the sheer number of the FISO masses and the number of teams their handling of the game over the past couple of seasons (the July transfers!) has put off being entered, they've probably lost more than they owe me now anyway, which is a small consolation.

Just hope that more FISOers contnue to boycott the game and Rich continues to win well in it.

It's a shame really because I liked the game for being the only one that combined the EPL and SPL and they usually did update score very quickly.

As has been said by Andy though, no point playing it if there's even a chance they're going to change the rules after it's finished to suit themselves.

The main reason I didn't sue ultimately was that the claim would have had to have been brought in a Scottish Court and their small claims procedure is different to ours and only goes up to £500, so wouldn't have covered it. So I'd have had several trips to Edinburgh and back and it would have gone to a 'big' court so the hassle just wasn't worth it.

Cheers lads, made my night reading this!

Knotty

Post by **12345678** » 13 Jul 2006, 00:18

just thought i was so bothered about missing the beginning of the scottish league that i'll be away on holiday in menorca till 5th august anyway and certainly wouldn't bother with this there anyway

girlfriend would be suitably unimpressed

andy

Post by **dead parrot** » 13 Jul 2006, 00:53

12345678 wrote:not really with just 3 transfer windows - i think a quick glance 3 times a year isn't quite the same as monitoring fixture changes and sunday midweek timing differences. and potential different timings of transfers due to different scottish kick offs - e.g. regular earlies on sunday

have i missed something parrot or is there really any real comparison in effort required

andy.

true.
my thinking not yet into full TFF mode for the new season
though my comment was influenced by memories of attempts at individual months when some studying of fixtures is beneficial though obviously not in the detail the herald requires

nb - can we assume transfer windows for record/mirror in the style of last season? Or will the mirror world cup model prevail?

Post by **Rich** » 13 Jul 2006, 08:01

I Hope they go back to the 4 windows of last season personally DP, Although fluid transfers wouldl help us when those annoying injuries happen just after a window it's same for all and normally evens itself out over a season. The 4 windows format makes the game unique, we don't want all the comps eventually all morphing into the same 'perfect' model, that would be boring imo.

Post by **dead parrot** » 13 Jul 2006, 09:42

Rich I agree with you in terms of variety of comp though there is a danger that the mirror will be taken over by the mega multi-entrant players and dominated by them, which is disastrous for the serious fringe such as yourself. If the rules of last season continue I can imagine a certain player putting in something like 500 teams this season and others around 200+. More frequent and flexible transfer opportunities makes it much harder for the multi-entrant.

Post by **Striker** » 13 Jul 2006, 13:24

Agree totally Parrott. What you say Rich, that all teams are affected by events such as injuries just after windows is closed, is essentially correct. However someone who has say 30 teams might have a few which escape the "worstest" luck all season, while only a few "small single entry" managers will get the same luck, unless they increase their entries.

Mind you I'm thinking of becoming a multi entrant myself if the windows are maintained. Not a hundreds man of course, but even a wodge of 30 would go against my principles. But if you can't beat them ........

Post by **RSDundee** » 13 Jul 2006, 14:05

Well, myself & our team of Mini-Leaguers as bailing out of this bag of bollocks to join the Metro Newspaper setup, having played their free world cup game.

So long & thanks for all the fish.

Post by **aldo1** » 13 Jul 2006, 14:14

My work league of 20 or so (not sure of final numbers yet) have also bailed out of this as well

We have opted for the Fantasy Premier - i'm sure it will be much the same as the Metro (their world cup was fairly similar)

It was all down to the complication of buying extra transfers etc - ok for the serious player but about 18 out of the 20 in the league were only in it for fun

I was also going to put 10 teams in this season but am now only going to do 5

They will live to regret this absolutely absurd change in their transfer rules

Post by **rimsie** » 13 Jul 2006, 15:00

Flaps
Why do they have to fiddle with it - played the last 2 seasons with mini leagues in the work and its been great.

Any suggestions for an alternative?
Cheers

Post by **aldo1** » 13 Jul 2006, 15:17

rimsie wrote:Flaps
Why do they have to fiddle with it - played the last 2 seasons with mini leagues in the work and its been great.

Any suggestions for an alternative?
Cheers

Glad to see yet another mini league moving away from this game - might teach them that it doesnt pay to be greedy

re Alternatives there are a lot of games out there it's really hard to gauge

I sent out an e-mail to my work colleagues asking them what they fancied

Told them about the TFF and Fantasy Premier and they went with Fantasy Premier - big selling point was that it was free and the website is good (they are not hardcore players and are NOT into win overall, just have fun and hopefully do well in their superleague) - the captain thing and squad thing appealed to them to

Also goes on a weekly basis for transfers and therefore you dont need to be at a PC like 30 mins before a certain kick off

Loads to chose from - you can maybe let me know what you guys opted for

Post by **Achilles** » 14 Jul 2006, 08:20

aldo1 wrote: I was also going to put 10 teams in this season but am now only going to do 5

They will live to regret this absolutely absurd change in their transfer rules

You were going to give them 15-20 quids (old entry fees) but now you'll give them "only" 45?
I don't think they will regret it, aldo1.
I was going to enter 50 teams but now will enter none.
That's a kind of thing they may regret.

Post by **aldo1** » 14 Jul 2006, 09:11

Achilles wrote:
aldo1 wrote: I was also going to put 10 teams in this season but am now only going to do 5

They will live to regret this absolutely absurd change in their transfer rules

You were going to give them 15-20 quids (old entry fees) but now you'll give them "only" 45?
I don't think they will regret it, aldo1.
I was going to enter 50 teams but now will enter none.
That's a kind of thing they may regret.

Unfortunatley Achilles,.. it's the game i'm best at so am kind of backed into a corner here.

If i didnt think i had a chance of winning it i wouldnt play it

I still think they will regret it as your normal joe punter that plays in his works super league for the banter and to beat his workmates will not be happy with having to pay for extra transfers.

Nobody in my superleague was interested in playing this after the rule change

Post by **rimsie** » 14 Jul 2006, 10:31

Looks like I was outvoted, they still want to play this game while I was pushing for the Telegraph game. The mix of scottish and english leagues was the clincher.

Post by **aldo1** » 14 Jul 2006, 11:28

rimsie wrote:Looks like I was outvoted, they still want to play this game while I was pushing for the Telegraph game. The mix of scottish and english leagues was the clincher.

Just out of curiosity are your boys paying the £10 at the start (£5 for tv's and £5 for entry)?

My guys were not willing to do this,.. think for a lot of them it was more the principal thing and not affordability

I'll let you know how we all get on with the fantasy premier

Cheers

Post by **binky** » 14 Jul 2006, 11:47

kcolrain wrote:Gentlemen and ladies,

The old Herald game has gone it alone and is NOW open for business. There is no need for transfer codes this year, we've retained free transfers with the option to buy more transfers and uniquely, a new prize/s, overall and monthly, for the worst-performing team. Check out our East Stirlingshire Memorial award and more new features/terms and rules, including £1,000 Manager of the Month prizes at:
http://www.britishfantasyfootball.com/

Regards and enjoy the season

Kevin Colrain

Gamemaster

thankyou and will certainly enjoy this season,it just wont have anything associated with your pants game

Post by **murf** » 14 Jul 2006, 11:54

This is my favourite thread

Post by **aldo1** » 15 Jul 2006, 00:52

murf wrote:This is my favourite thread

any thoughts on the rule changes from these cowboys Murf?

Post by **bloggs** » 15 Jul 2006, 07:47

I've played the Herald's Fantasy Football for the last three years, since it started. The first two years were free, the third year Setanta got involved and there was a charge to play, two quid if I remember, you got a pound off if you had the promotional code!!

This year I received an email telling me that BFF was ready for the coming season, after chosing my team and following the instructions to the end I was to pay £5 and an option to buy more transfer codes..... no way.... not this year..... I'm not joining.... I'm in it for the fun and friendly rivalry between mates and collegues but I'm not willing to pay out that much.......a 500% increase. Just think last year there must have been over 400,000 teams playing, thats a minimum of £2million BFF will receive, they've obviously woken up and smelt crisp fivers.

I propose we bouycott British Fantasy Football and see what the effect is next year!!

Post by **aldo1** » 15 Jul 2006, 10:17

bloggs wrote:I've played the Herald's Fantasy Football for the last three years, since it started. The first two years were free, the third year Setanta got involved and there was a charge to play, two quid if I remember, you got a pound off if you had the promotional code!!

This year I received an email telling me that BFF was ready for the coming season, after chosing my team and following the instructions to the end I was to pay £5 and an option to buy more transfer codes..... no way.... not this year..... I'm not joining.... I'm in it for the fun and friendly rivalry between mates and collegues but I'm not willing to pay out that much.......a 500% increase. Just think last year there must have been over 400,000 teams playing, thats a minimum of £2million BFF will receive, they've obviously woken up and smelt crisp fivers.

I propose we bouycott British Fantasy Football and see what the effect is next year!!

Not sure there were that many teams bloggs, however, i do agree with everything you say and there will be lots more like you

I really hope that they get low numbers

I cant see why they wouldnt,.. i know so many people that have decided not to play this already,.. fingers crossed there are more that boycott

Absolute disgrace

Post by **Art Vandelay** » 18 Jul 2006, 19:52

I've never even looked at this game before but after seeing it the 'listed as they launch' thread I was thinking about entering. Having read this I don't think I'll bother. So that's another tenner from the £850 they've lost!

What exactly happend then? What was the reason for not paying out?

Post by **CanaryYellow** » 18 Jul 2006, 21:28

Knotty was not from the papers catchment area and they wanted to award it to some Scotsman i believe was the scandalous reason.

Post by **admin** » 18 Jul 2006, 22:23

CanaryYellow wrote:Knotty was not from the papers catchment area and they wanted to award it to some Scotsman i believe was the scandalous reason.

The reason was they didn't feel it was what they called a 'genuine mini-league' because it only consisted of teams managed by just 2 people. For a full debate see the original thread:

http://www.fantasyfootballuk.co.uk/arch ... .php?t=589

Post by **anon6** » 18 Jul 2006, 22:52

interesting....but still won't be playing....the website does not display punctuation when I view with Firefox.

Post by **12345678** » 18 Jul 2006, 23:32

one year i was 2nd for a long time - my memory is it was open entry, they then changed the rules to needing to get the rag, i obtained this from a contact in their catchment area. i was then told that they probably still wouldn't give me the prize if i won as i wasn't in the catchment area.

the bottom line running throughout this apart from the access issues is that they keep changing their mind mucking up and being basically untrustworthy and disingenuous.

that's why i won't be playing.

judging by the lack of comment from them after the initial ramping it looks like the same people even though they have tried to make out it is not.

it would be good if there was a general fiso boycott but i respect that some people may want to play the game. hopefully others will be put off by reading the thread and spend their money on a better game that is run with more propriety.

andy.

Post by **quizking** » 19 Jul 2006, 10:13

www.isp.org.uk
the director general, a mr. mutton, has been very helpful (in non-ff related issues) in getting companies to follow up on promotions and actually "paying up" - seems like he acts as a sort of ombudsman. didn't know about them a couple of years ago, but might still be useful for advice if any other company should be reticent in giving out prizes - otherwise the press complaints commission might be a help with future newspaper-based comps.

whatever the organisers say here, at the top of their own t and c's it clearly states that the game is run with the herald and evening times.

my beta firefox browser doesn't give the correct punctuation with the site either, but works apart from that.

having looked around the site and looking down mini-leagues list, they already have quite a few entries so doesn't look like there has been a blanket boycott. i'll reluctantly be entering just one or two teams - less than would have done otherwise - as have done fairly well in this before and feel have an outside chance of a win. only paying extra for transfers if i get a flying start though. so will be looking out for a (much slimmed down) fiso minileague nearer the time.

Post by **aldo1** » 19 Jul 2006, 12:24

There might not be a 'blanket boycott' quizking but they might still find themselves down on numbers from last year and that will make me happy

I see that there are less than 1000 managers so far,.. if my memory serves me correctly then they had about 15,000 last season.

The season starts next Satruday = 10 days

I reckon that over 1,000 people will have to join everday til then for them to just match last years numbers

As i mentioned my super league of 20 are all not playing this year and i'm sure there will be others like this

This is now the most expensive game i know and im sure it will put a lot of would be managers off

be great if the greedy bar stewards got less than 10,000 managers (a drop of about a third on last year) - my fingers are crossed

Post by **kcolrain** » 19 Jul 2006, 13:21

Dear all,

I’m sorry to hear that some people feel put off by the changes that we’ve introduced this year. The pricing changes were introduced to cover increased costs and to allow for an increased prize fund. The manager of the month prizes are up, from £250 + a Setanta subscription, to £1,000 each month. We’ve also introduced the East Stirlingshire Memorial Award (with an overall as well as monthly prize) for the lowest scoring team – a unique feature as far as we’re aware and one that requires a whole new approach and strategy. Although the ‘full’ £10 cost per team is higher than last year, we felt that this was still reasonable, equating as it does to just over £1 per month of game play.

We’ve also completely removed the need to purchase a newspaper in order to get transfer codes.

For mini-league managers who want to restrict transfers to maintain a level playing field, we’ve introduced the ‘transfers used this month’ column to the mini-league table, to allow for transparent monitoring of transfer usage.

We’re confident that British Fantasy Football will continue to compare well with other games in terms of playability, reliability and speed of updates. With regards to some of the other concerns highlighted here, I’m sure you’ll all appreciate that I’m unable to discuss individual cases on a public forum.

Best regards

BFF Gamemaster

Post by **Knotty** » 19 Jul 2006, 14:18

kcolrain wrote:With regards to some of the other concerns highlighted here, I’m sure you’ll all appreciate that I’m unable to discuss individual cases on a public forum.

You were unprepared to listen to, or do anything about, the decision in private either so that's a crock of proverbial.

Take it you've not changed your minds on the SL prize from 2004/05?........thought not. That'll be me and a LOT of teams from people on here not playing then.

Coming on here and hawking for more business now smacks of desperation to me! Numbers not what they should be eh, who'd have thought it!

Thanks for coming.

Loving this thread!

Post by **aldo1** » 19 Jul 2006, 14:32

kcolrain wrote: For mini-league managers who want to restrict transfers to maintain a level playing field, we’ve introduced the ‘transfers used this month’ column to the mini-league table, to allow for transparent monitoring of transfer usage.

I appreciate the reponse but let me tell you where this falls down.

If we all agree to use no additional transfers in our mini league (which is the only way my guys would have played) to create a 'level playing field', then what would happen if say after the first month or so one or two of the managers get off to a flyer. Do you think that they are not going to be tempted to buy additional transfers?

Same applies if one of the managers is having a particualrly good month - do you not think he will want to buy additional transfers in order to try and win the monthly

You wouldnt blame them if they did

If either of the two scenarios above happen (which they inevitably will) then the super league will be ruined.

I think i'm going to let this lie now but am still annoyed that you have ended my works superleague of 3 years. OK, we are playing a new game but it shouldnt have been like that

As for the knotty situation,. Even although you guys think you are right (

),. £850 would have been worth paying to avoid the reputation you have since built.

Not confident that you will get the numbers that you are expecting but good luck anyway,.. think you'll need it

Post by **12345678** » 19 Jul 2006, 14:37

kcolrain wrote:
With regards to some of the other concerns highlighted here, I’m sure you’ll all appreciate that I’m unable to discuss individual cases on a public forum.

Best regards

BFF Gamemaster

the whole point is that the game has been mucked up in some shape or form every year yet mr colrain is unable to give any assurances that anything will change whatsoever so you need to be aware that if you play this game you are likely to encounter rule changes site downtime etc.

my only concession to mr colrain is that it is a well designed game and it is good to have him post on here.

other than that why play a game that is known for moving the goalposts site downtime and rule changes during the competition or after it for elegibility for prizes.

soon after chris set this site up he told me part of the reason was to try to keep the games organisers in check and whilst i think that has often failed most notably with the times i do feel that this thread has given people a chance to make their mind up whether to play very well.

andy

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return of British Fantasy Football

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