The fact that Xmas is over commercial may not be a bad thing. Most people I know look forward to some time off year, a few drinks with your work colleagues and time with the family. We don't harp on about the religious side of things but as we are live in a Christian based country, loosley based on Christian ethics, where people are free to practice whatever religion they like, its not surpising that the key festival is Christmas. Easter too, to a lesser extent. Should anyone find this so abhorrent then they can just get on a plane for a couple of weeks and come back in January.

Surprised, I think your gripe is with the Daily Mail. Everytime someone posts a thread its the Mail this and the Mail that. You're always going to have different newspapers that are going to appeal to different groups of individuals. I like the Independant so that's why I appreciated AMc's link and it made me stop and think. However bad the Mail is, then the Guardian is the exact mirror image IMO. That's why you need something like the Indie in the middle.

I picked up an 'Independent' in midweek and iwas surprised taht it was a tad leftie leaning in places (not as bad as the Guardian obviously - or the Mail (o even the Tele) in the other direction) so I would never consider it to be a true balanced reflection of the world. they all have owners, editors and journalists with personal feelings and agendas.

You noticed that I don't like the Mail that much then. I wondered if that would show through . I don't really like the Guardian but at least that paper tells mostly the truth. The Mail is misleading at best and almost every headline lies as it never relates to the truth in the article. My paper of choice when in the UK is the Independent.

Only a wee bit At least we both agree on the same newspaper of choice

I prefer the Daily Sport, it's much more informative.

I certainly dont think for one second you're a racist Nosey but I dont see how it can be cut fast, at least not sensibly?

Like it or not, we're desperately short of skills in the UK, especially technical skills which is why I dont see a 'cap' as sensible. I'm no fan of Labour but the points system seems far more appealing. Worth remembering how this country is reliant on foreign skills. If they all decided leave we wouldn't have a functioning NHS for a start.

We know we can do nothing about people from the EU.

Good point TC. I'm not saying stop completely but if 50K emigrate, then 50K can immigrate. Something with a little bit of thought behind it. Our youth unemployment is now sky high Surely some of those can be trained ad whilst there are the usual workshy dossers, there's lots of young people who are keen to get on the job ladder, who can't

Having said that I've recently done some shopping for odds ands sods. Been to three shops - all with countless rows of tills and only a couple of people serving. In B & Q I had to self serve my new xmas tree, as no tills were open. Try scanning a 7ft box and then balancing it on the weighing scale whilst trying to pay ! Go to somewhere like Argos and there will be a few kids running around like crazy at the collection point and shed loads of people waving their tickets at the poor workers. Everywhere is so painfully short staffed, even at Xmas. Talk about skeleton staff. Its seems to be the same everywhere, although the fat cats continue to make the mega bucks

It is the same in Canada, Bluenosey. Finding a salesperson when help is needed is near impossible. I presume the reason is that since this practice is so widespread few customers are lost, expenses are down hence more profits. The more upscale the shop is the more staff as the clientele expects better service. Or so they tell me as I rarely visit anyplace upscale. I don't think this is an immigrant issue, just a profit one. I am not anti-immigrant but capitalism demands constant growth, an internal contradiction that means ever increasing population, usually through immigration to fill low-scale jobs, and devouring of resources which is proving unsustainable. How we get off this merry-go-round to a system that is sustainable is a difficult question but we are running out of time to figure it out.

I'm not sure too many of them have the capacity to be trained for technical 'jobs' tbh.

When you hear of school leavers with qualifications, even some graduates having to be sent on numeracy courses by employers which frankly is pathetic & shows how bad the education system has become. Targets that encourage quantity over quality? I've no idea who 1st allowed calculators to be used in the classroom but that was the start of a slippery slope imho.

'We've' created the workshy dossers. No doubt many have grown up in households where nobody has worked for a living, happy to live off of benefits, a culture that would take decades to change & it certainly wont change in my life-time